Nintendo and Sony are going at it again. This time, the arena is the HAND HELD CONSOLES. CNN once again...

Well, Nintendo seems to be getting a head start. I'm not quite sure if that's a good thing, because when Nintendo rushes things, they usually end up sucking and/or dissapearing from the market. Virtual Boy anyone? Oh, and has Sony redesigned the PSP? Because it looks quite a bit more compact than the one I saw in the E3 videos.

Supposedly, Nintendo stopped makeing the VB not because of its poor sales, but because it spread head lice amongst kids...

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Just one step closer to CocaWarner McMicroSonySoft...

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The way I see it, when they compete, we (the gamers) win.

Ninendo will win the Japanese market, Sony will win the US and European markets. Or so I predict.

I do think that the two are actually going to be taking markets that only slightly overlap. Nintendo is going to produce a hand-held console targetted at the kids to young adults range, priced at $150US. Sony is attempting at a portable media center specifically not tagetted to anybody less than about age 20, and the thing is likely to cost well over $200US (I'm guessing 250-300). There will be some competition, though it would not be turly correct to consider them both fighting over the same market share. If you were to put them both together, I'm thinking the ratio in the US might be arround 70%-30% (Nintendo-Sony). Don't forget that Nintendo has held a virtual monopoly on the hand-held console market for roughly a decade and a half, and Sony is merely about to try jumping in. Remember what happened to the N-Gage... I believe the PSP will fare considerably better, but will be stuck in the serious minority.

One of the main things I see as being Nintendo's edge is storage. Sony plans to use their proprietary mini-disc technology, which had failed to go anywhere in the PC market. While per-unit cost of producing each disc will be low, I doubt that such a fragile media would be wise for a small, portable device. The main thing that worries me is that that leaves the question of what user data is going to be stored on... I'm guessing they might try using Sony memory sticks. Unfortuantely, SMSs ae fairly expensive storage, and not terribly compatible with other devices (only Sony devices use them).

As for Nintendo, they've already set up that they are using their old cartridge system. While this is considerably more expensive than a laser-based disc system, it has several advantages. Cartridges are far more durable than discs, for one. Also, the cartridge allows for chips other than ROM to be used per game; a non-volatile memory chip is likely to be in each piece to provide each game/product its own storage. Of course, some companies willing to pay even more may add a supplementary processor to it, which was seen very much in the SNES (think the SuperFX chip in Star Fox and Doom). I don't think that ROM space is a real issue here: each individual ROM chip so far has a maximum capacity of 128MB, and I believe a single cartridge would be able to hold 2-4 of them, giving up to 0.5GB; I suspect 256MB chips are not that far into the future.

hahaha, nice :p

HAHAHAHA. Ignorance strikes AGAIN!

Let's see--so far you've been erroneus on every count but one.

1) The PSP will NOT cost over 200 dollars. If it did, Sony wouldn't make it. Unless I'm mistaken, the PS2 didn't even cost over 200 dollars at release. I suspect 150-170 to stay competetive with Nintendo

2) The media is not fragile at all. It's encased in a plastic, heavy-duty case, with a small disc inside. If you've ever used a CD you'd know it's about as fragile as that--meaning not at all, really.

3) WTF? ROM chips can hold in the gigs of space, last time I checked. Maybe not as small as what the DS is using, but I'm sure they could fit 256MB in there if not 512 or higher.

$300

Show me proof? I googled for it but couldn't come up with anything. But Sony would not be stupid enough to launch a handheld twice the price of their competitor's.

From an IGN article:

PSP Price Confirmed


Similar article here.

CNN article here:


This site has a picture of the PSP Universal Media Disc. Doesnt look too flimsy.

Sony redesigned the PS2 dubbed the PSTwo. Basically, it's smaller.

http://ps2.ign.com/articles/549/549938p1.html

Oh, really? I'd like to see you actually try to show I'm wrong, instead of just claiming it.


WRONG! The PS2 cost $300 US upon release, just like the Microsoft XBox, and the original Playstation. Any reasearch from any media source could reveal this. (Try looking through places like Gamespot). Give the expense of the hardware Sony is planning on including in it, they would be selling them at a serious loss if they attempted to sell them at a price competitive with Nintendo (Sony is using largely new components, whereas several of the DS's parts are re-used, such as the ARM-7 secondary processor, which served as the GBA's primary processor)


The case does increase how durable it is, though the pictures I've seen that it only affords protection equivalent to a jewell case. As for the fragility of a laser disc, I'm not meaning it's like glass. Since it's a portable system, I envisioned the chance that the discs could get sat on (such as if they fell between cusions). While dropping a disc wouldn't harm it, the average American would weigh enough to snap it in two, case arround it or no. (try sitting on a jewell case to find out)


ROM chips =! Flash Chips

Nintendo is trying to cut the cost of cartridges here (the only real disadvantage of them). Remember, while you can buy a USB disk that hold 4GB, it also costs $1,000 (US, try froogle to find the proof). I'd guess that a single 128MB ROM chip might cost about $2-$5 US to manufacture. I'm sure there will be bigger chips availible even from the start, but I don't think they'll see much use, as most increased expense in manufacturing is usually transferred to the customer (notice that new console games cost
$50-$60, compared to $30-$50 for PC CD-ROM games. The trend for this high price came from Nintendo's cartridges, and manufacturers saw no reason to lower price once they moved to DVDs, as consumers were buying them quite well enough)


Precisely. You have no real idea what you're talking about. Now where's that SAIN-bashing pic? I'd be so ironic for me to use it.

Things always cost more in outlying countries upon release date than they do in the US. Why? Because companies can pull that ****, which sucks.

Okay, I'll admit it MIGHT hit 250, but I doubt even that. Sony's gotta keep it competitive, and no one's gonna pay 300 dollars for a handheld (as seen via N-Gage).

I still see this thing selling for ~200 during Christmas if it comes out this year.

As for Flash chips--256mb flash drives cost what, 40-50 bucks? Around here they do. Cheap. Considering that's probably about 10x what it costs to make, if not more, and the games are about that much, I can see them easily fitting one into a cartridge. Flash drives AREN'T ROM chips, you're right. But they're similar.

But about your other little quips--try harder next time.

And you've been wrong about so many things concerning computers before (most notably your advice on video cards). You just make big posts, which is likely to impress people.

Oh sweet irony. DJ Yoshi, I hope you like the taste of foot, :p

Especially since thier markets are doing way better than ours. But that's not the point is it? The major problem is the question about where the unit is being produced, since the cost of having it imported is what will likely make the largest difference.





Market analysts said that no one would pay for a video graphics accelerator (ala Voodoo 1). Market analysts also thought that a $300 video game console would never sell out. Anal seems to be the key word.





Where is that priced at and when can I get an address? Last I checked 128mb sd cards were going to well over $60. Also, you are correct, thats well over 10x the cost of production on those bad boys. Considering flash media and other camera/mp3 player accessories are where retail chains make thier money, I would assume that the markup is to be expected.



I think you've been wrong about things as well Yoshi. I don't think you're qualified to assess someone else's capacity for incorrect statements.

I'm not sure Nintendo is guilty of ever rushing anything. In fact, I believe, that's almost their biggest flaw. In a marketting sense anyway. The PS2 is a mediocre console compared to the others, in my opinion, but enjoys most of the market due to being the first out there with huge software support. Nintendo tends to wait to perfect their hardware.

You could say the Virtual Boy was an exception but I would call that an experiment that failed. Gameboy Advance is another exception as they improved upon it with the SP however they dominated the market and had the freedom to do that.

There are other things I'd like to point out about other Nintendo consoles but I'll skip for now to address the topic at hand. I think this is, potentially, where Nintendo can really slip in the handheld market. I think alot of people will want a broader capability offered in the PSP. I do, however, believe that Nintendo getting to the market first at a reasonable price may keep them on top. I might actually consider one for myself.

On a side not, the "new" PS2s look nice. Picture a PS2 at one quarter scale. "I call him ... mini-PS2." muahahahaha muahahahaha muahahahaha

The articles saying that the price of the PSP is $400+ is old. We'll wait to see what Sony will say. As of this point, both of these handhelds do look promising. I'm not all that interested in either though because I'm fine with a console and PC.
edit: PSP is confirmed to support mp3s.

That's not market analysis, Farix, that's the fact that the ngage sold CRAPPILY at 300 bucks, and not much better at 150 I think was its reduced price? because of it's original price.

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-183-136&depa=0
that's a 128 mb flash drive.

And have you ever seen his comments on nvidia vs ATi cards? They're laughably naive, like he hadn't been following the market since the advent of DX7.

His video card comments aside, he still owned you.

If by 'owned' you mean 'was wrong on half the stuff he said' then sure.

You must have checked a long time ago. I bought a 256mb Kingston SD card last week for $36 CANADIAN.

[edit]Here's a link, the price has already gone down from last week

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