Part of what made Star Wars legitimate was that when the aliens talked, there were English subtitles. It was like watching a foriegn film. But in the prequels, we got aliens that only sounded alien because they didn't have American accents.

Seriously, Lucas could have raised the prequels' IQ by several points if he gave us subtitles instead of aliens that can magically speak English...

Interesting, Tracer. I never noticed that before. Is there a single alien in all of the Original Trilogy other than Yoda that speaks English?

Uh... wrong forum.

There are Jabba, Anakin, Whatto, Sebulba, Palpatines Rhodian secretary, the Geonosians...
All of them are subtitled.

Forgot about Watto. I was thinking mainly of those goofy long-neck aliens Obi-wan talks to in Ep 2, Gungans and the Oriental Trade Federation guys.



Yeah, there's Admiral Ackbar. But even better than subtitles is nothing - let us figure out what they're saying my their actions.

Yeah. Like chewie!

"Chewie get back here!"

"grawaw *leans back and shakes head furiously*"

Artoo is a good example as well of that. He isn't an alien, but you can interpret what he says.

I'm telling you, JarJar's not worth the time to subtiitle. First off, he flaps his lips for practically the entire time he's in a scene, and secondly he never has anything decent to say anyway.

And how are you supposed to translate "mesa" into English? /head 'splodes

Yeah, I noticed that too, Tracer. It is true; the alien languages make the movies more authentic.

As for Jar Jar, I can easily say that I would have been satisfied with TPM if Jar Jar never was in it.

Think about what you're saying...

Not even Watto was subtitled most of the time. Only when he briefly spoke in another language to Anakin.

I thought there was something called Galatic Basic.

Havent you played KotOR? "Most aliens understand Galactic Basic, even if they don't speak it."

Yeah, anyone else notice when they enter hyperspace in the new movies, they show it from the OUTSIDE of the ship, but not the inside like in the old movies?

Good call, Tracer. I didn't realize that until you pointed it out.




Really, though, the problem with the new tril is that it tries to pander to young kids.

yeah, I noticed that too.

I like watching the starlines from inside the cockpits, you dont get that on the outside.

Wot about the ewoks! YUB YUB(power)

On a semi related topic why wasnt the millenium falcon destroyed when it flew at lightspeed into the remains of Alderaan? Especially seeing just before going into lightspeed Han had warned of such a catastrophe?

Does nobody realise the obvious reason which is Steven Spielburg (sp?) directed the old movies and Lucas just wrote them. Lucas directs the new movies.

em... if we were talking about Indiana Jones, then yes, you would be correct. Lucas directed A New Hope.

Blasphemy!!!

ummm....the new movies suck for a whole lot of reasons. Watching the classic trilogy on DVD recently has solidified my opinion that Lucas has really just lost "it" these days.

The new movies, simply, are mostly exposition and action and not enough emotion and humor to drive them.

Lucas has always been a great conceptual thinker, but it becomes increasingly clear that one of the reasons Episode IV turned out so well is that Lucas COULDN'T do everything that he wanted.

And how many of you can remember entire conversations from the new movies? The old ones were legendary because many of the lines the actors had were so strange in a positive way. The new movies have strange lines in a bad, corny way.

Although the actors can't be forgotten here: Samuel L. Jackson as Mace Windu and Christopher Lee as Count Dooku. They somehow succeeded in giving some old style SW meaning to their characters and lines, but otherwise the new movies weren't any different than any other bulk movies in this respect.

Only reason why Christopher Lee is such a bad *** as Dooku is because the dude has been acting since the late 1940s (1948). He was even a Bond villian (The Man with the Golden Gun) among dozens of other movies. He even acted along side Peter Cushing (Grand Moff Tarkin in the original) for dozens of movies. As the abridged script reads

Sam Jackson, Christopher Lee and Ewan Mcgregor all turn in good performances in these 'films' but they are really the only saving grace besides some semi entertaining lightsaber battles.

The new movies are just bad, and I can almost feel these great actors cringe at having to say such cornball lines like "Its clear we are a match when it comes to the force, this battle must be decided by our skill with the lightsaber!" (paraphrasing there)

I mean, WTF is that?

Vader: "So Obi-Wan...its a draw at tic-tac-toe...we'll have to settle this with a game of marbles."

Lucas is just an old fruitbat who doesn't know what the hell he's doing anymore. Like Agent-Smith said...the new revisions and the new movies continue to make me thing Lucas never really had it to begin with, rather he didn't have enough control back then to signifigantly screw up his good ideas like he does now. His lack of control over his films was precisely why they were so good, not inspite of it.

What I think makes the prequels lack in the domain of being a Star Wars film is that so many things we remember from the originals is missing. There is rarely any talk of the dark side. It's like it's just not a problem. There's none of that "the path to the dark side" stuff... And maybe that's rightly so. I mean I suppose Vader probably taught them that the dark side shouldn't be taken so lightly. So maybe that's for the best. As far as the prequels go, I think Attack of the Clones is by far better than TPM, but then again that's not saying a whole lot. What makes it better is that it includes some of that offbeat humor and campy dialogue that the OT had so much of, but what truly causes the movies to fall to pieces is the fact that lucas can do whatever he wants to. I understand that Lucas wanted to show the irony that the baddest mother f*cker in the galaxy used to be a nice little kid, but for god's sake the I see dead people kid would have been a better choice. What makes those movies so truly bad is simply the fact that Lucas is a bad director.

Consider the following:

The strongest of the OT is Empire. Why? Directed by Irvin Kirschner (sp?). Not directed by Lucas. Script by two other guys. Story by Lucas.

A New Hope is pretty darn good considering Lucas helmed the project, but look who he was working with. Alec Guinness. Expert actor. Harrison Ford. Expert actor. Mark Hammil. Weak point of the movie. And it's not hard to direct a puppet or a guy in a suit. When the only dialogue is done through voice over, which can be redone infinitely until perfect, a performance CAN'T really suck.

Now consider this:

In the prequels, who delivers a good performance? Ewan McGregor. Expert Actor. Liam Neeson. Expert actor. Ian McDirmand. Expert Actor. Christopher Lee. Expert actor. Sam Jackson. Expert actor. And it's not hard to get a good performance out of a CG actor. Jar Jar is pulled off perfectly, he's just not a like-able character. It's nothing about these cg characters other than the fact that we hate alot of them. I have been watching movies since the beginning of my life that have characters that I hate, but it does not ruin the movie for me.

TPM and AOTC both share two common characteristics:

Bad acting.

Good story.

Like it or not, the stories of these prequels are nice. The action is well done, and alot of the actors DO deliver good performances. But thanks to people like Hayden Christensen, Natalie Portman, and others like them, we've got some real problems on our hands with these movies. Don't get me wrong, niether of them are BAD actors. They each have their good points in the films, but the problem here is Lucas. He is a BAD director. There was serious potential in these movies to be good. The lines have the potential to be funny most of the time, and the love story dialogue could have been good had it been delivered better. Lucas cannot turn a mediocre actor into a good one, and good directors can.

Spielberg, Stone, Kubrik, and others like them possess the ability to turn a crap actor into a fan favorite. If Lucas could work with these people, and do things the way Quentin Tarantino does, these movies would be much better. Instead of just saying "oh well we can't really get this part, so this is good enough" Tarantino says "well have you ever seen *movie x* it's a lot like when *character a* says *statement b* to *character c*." He puts it into perspective, and the actors deliver. Lucas apparantly does not have the ability to do this.

As I said before, the camera work is great, the movies are nice to look at, but the actors have no one to work with. Sure an expert actor like McGregor or Jackson can deliver the worst dialogue ever and make it work, like the guys did in the old films, but these no talents can't do that. Lucas has just fallen too much in love with making a "pretty picture" rather than enlisting someone else to help these people act. I've seen good performances out of all of these actors, and there is no reason why they should fall apart in Star Wars.

Too much CGI in the 1st and 2nd i think... relies on it too much

the guy that played chewie actualy had lines, they were just for reactions. He had them growled over in post production.

lol it would be interesting to read chewies original lines, it would almost be like a translation for his growls. It would be funny if he said things that had no revelation in the star wars universe at all just for 'reaction'

No. The story in the prequels is indeed lacking. Like have been said before, Lucas forgot what Darth Vader said right in the New Hope: "The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant when compared to the power of the Force". The Force was nothing but a tool in the new movies. Other than the sorrowful state of the Force, the new movies were lacking the unsubstantial elements of the old movies: The strong, personal feelings of the characters, the aim(s) they had through all the trilogy, the purpose (destiny) they chased, the difficulties they faced (so different compared to the pure fighting of the new movies).

Alas, the story is badly lacking, and bad directing only makes it worse. You all have probably heard before that the only feedback Lucas gives the actors is "Again!"... You figure out how to enhance your performance with that

I liked the old ships, when they were built out of tons of model pieces. They're just too streamlined now. Even if they are getting les so.

Don't forget, Ian McDermid is pretty good as Palpatine.

Those would make great funny captions like "Rock, Paper, Saddam!".
I believe Harrision Ford even mentions something about Lucas's directing abilities on the DVDs.

True. I hate the Naboo Royal Cruiser. It seems to be strangely constructed from mathematical curves.

Me too. And I want to know why all the ships are so streamlined and badass in the the new trilogy...but the old trilogy which supposedly happens after this one, all the ships are boxy.

Stick with the damn universe lucas!

EXACTLY!

Bill, Harrison Ford wasn't an expert actor when ANH was filmed

The story for ANH wsn't exactly original or extraordinary. It jsut took place in a new setting. I also find it kind of funny when people complain about the acting despite the fact that the acting in the original trilogy was hardly spectacular

*runs down deathstar hallway screaming*