Ok, apparently the whole idea behind an argument has been lost around here. The point of an argument is to convince your opponent that your position is correct. This cannot be achieved by flaming him. It can only be achieved by calmly and respectfully arguing your opponents position. Flaming your opponent will only cause him to think his own position is right. Insulting some one because he disagrees with you is something 10 year olds do. Not mature adults.

Also, just because you disagree with some one is not a reason to hate him or to not respect him. While it may limit your relationship to some extent it is very arrogant to not respect someone’s opinion even if you know/think it is wrong. The only reason to dislike some one as a result of an argument would be if they have stated their opinion in an arrogant manner, and/or have insulted you for believing differently from you.

On a personal note, as a Christian I do believe that some things are evil, but I do not in any way believe that I am better than anyone else. I believe that all including me have sinned and have fallen short of the glory of God, and but for the grace of God I would be condemned to his wrath. I don’t believe that it was through any effort, work or will of mine that I have become a Christian, but purely through God’s grace. Therefore it would be very arrogant to assume that I am any better than any one else. It would like taking the credit for some one rescuing me from a river. Because of that, I have a responsibility to God, to be a humble witness for my religion. I cannot do this by acting arrogantly, or by wrongly assuming that I am some how better than any one else.

We do have disagreements and arguments in the forum, but please in the future try do argue with a humbler more respectful attitude of trying to get the other person to agree with you. I am not saying I have always argued with the right attitude, but I would like to see us all try to make an effort to do this our debates and be more worthwhile experiences.

Discuss.

You copied and pasted?

i agree with what you say to a certain extent but i agree with paragraphs more.

[edit]i'm agnostic but i enjoyed your river metaphor, its a nice way of seeing things from a christian perspective.[/edit]

I don't respect stupidity.

you can only convince people right if you're not completely moronic

Oh boy, here we go again.

I have to do enough argumentation in my college english class. Doing it here takes too much time and puts me over the top of my argumentation threshold.

if you look at what obi is saying and if you look at the content of some of the replies... a giggle or two can be found within.

You're just starting your last thread, more generally.

Regardless, you could benefit to learn from what you just said. I can remember at least two threads where rather than refute my (or the opposing) point and justify yours, you basically talked with no direction or address to what had been said to you. What's your point here?

I think a personal title change is needed for Obi here: Wannabe Mini-mod.

I read that as "A few things on augmentation"

>_>

Anyways, Obi, you have been acting like kind of a dink recently.. As we've seen, Massassi isn't the kind of place to have a religon, or at least express it.

Yeah, that wasn't helpful, but hey "My eyes are augmented".

TABLE

I thought the topic was "A few things on augmentation" so my immediate reply is "Obi, dont believe everything those e-mails tell you."

Let it go guys...

I for one have always wondered about the lack of persuasive skills of people who are supposed to have them. Take priests for example.

Imagine a cool, modern guy talking to you about various stuff, the **** he pulled last weekend, how he got drunk with his buddies when he was in high school ... and then casually after an hour or so of good vibing and mutual stories, he'd drop in he's a priest and he believes in Jesus etc, before moving on to a next subject of the already cool conversation... you'd think hey cool, I can see why he'd believe in God, and I respect that. He's given me a lot to think about. What a fun guy! I hope we stay friends...

That would be an example of good communication, of persuasion and of general coolness. I wouldn't be persuaded at this point in my life, being Satan and all, but he would've definitely given me a glimpse of fundamentally good theist thinking.

This in contrast with the 90% of priests/fundies/theists who say you'll burn in hell if you don't convert and if you don't pay up for the Platinum Church Membership. Ummmm, yeah dude. God exists.

Yeah, I think it's valid that you vote Kerry, definitely given your history, but here's why I personally will vote Bush: x, y, z, ... Consider that for a while. I think it's cool though that you vote Kerry, definitely because of the dynamics in economical sector x. Anyway, gotta go man. Say hi to Sarah for me.

Ahhh, utopia.

Actually I'd settle for wannabe "Not Flame-bait"

The only problem is, just because YOU think something is wrong/evil, doesn't necessarily actually make you right or make it wrong/evil.

You know, Obi_Kwiet, from your past posts many have learnt that you won't change your opinions very easily, but continue to post them quite forcefully time after time. Such things can annoy the hell out of people and make even decent persons to start flaming. Even with "right" opinions discussions can turn ugly. Sometimes also the one who is right needs to back off.

<3 MaD CoW.

Well, if I kept on, you would have had to keep on too. I used to have trouble expressing myself, but recently I've descovered how to do so much better.



Tell me then, what makes things wrong or evil.

Things that are wrong and evil are interpreted by you.

gay marriage is wrong and evil? maybe to you, but to millions others it's acceptable

bush is wrong and evil? maybe to you, but to most of America, he's not.

but I do agree with your first post, an argument does not need to turn into a flame war, if you want to post, post soemthing constructive and that adds to the argument or helps your point, don't simply flame them.

in my last rant thread within minutes of posting i was called rasist, ignorant, stupid... many other things simply because of my opinion. Guess what, it's not the same as yours get over it, or at least present me with something that will make me change my mind rather then insult me until you feel your e-penis grow.

RRRRRR.... Must... resist... hijacking... own... thread...

Some people need to stop taking internet debates so personally.

My sig quote fits here REAL nice...

The internet is serious business.

Can we just ban him already?

Yeah yeah. Anyway, who cares what your religion is?

Can you tolerate someone's view if it promotes intolerance?

Ever heard the phrase "You can't love a hater"?

Tolerating something doesn't mean you have to like it.

Exactly. My closest group of friends and I are differ a bit on the religious and political spectrum. Through various religious beliefs, everyone considers everyone else is to be wrong (kind of funny, now that I think of it), but do we bring it up? No. We know each other's beliefs, and we know that if anyone else wants to know more about it, they'll ask. Otherwise, we leave it out of the discussion and live content lives, enjoying each other's company.

In fact, I wanna see us walk into a bar.

"A Protestant, an atheist, a Catholic, and a Wiccan walk into a bar..."

Paradox!
Anyway, every one is intolarnt to some point. Were all intolarant of murder, rape, ect. Anyway, how did the topic of intolarance come up?

Frozen_Heart, it's awfually dumb, to start lobbying to ban some one on your first day. I've had over 950 posts. You've been here one day. Don't start acting like you own the place on your first day, alright.

No one cares how long you've been here, because if you're being an ***, you can get banned. Frozen_heart has been here more than one day, he's an old member who just registered a new name.

I have nothing constructive left to say to you.

This is war! Tax the churches!

Urm, sorry. Playing too much NationStates. Anyway, it's funny reading Obi's posts now, to see how much Massassi's changed him. Remember when he would post the same thing over and over again, spelling half the words wrong and saying "you didnt adress my point" or whatever? Living proof that MASSASSI IS GOOD FOR YOU. Although certain negative aspects of his personality have remained, even become more intense. So maybe it's an up and down thing.

And now its time for some german heavy metal!
BWRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I just gotta let you know Obi, my only problem with you is the way you make the most inappropriate "jokes" sometimes. I can appreciate that you mean well, but just ... don't try to be funny.