Steve Forbes spoke in Overland Park, KS (an appropriately wealthy suburb of Kansas City). I had the opportunity to eat a continental breakfast, but, almost as importantly, I got to hear him discuss the flat tax.

The flat tax is the accountant's ultimate nightmare, a tax system that is not based on millions of words spread into a large number of books called "Tax Law". The tax that Steve Forbes advocates is not a pure flat tax, however. He envisions an exemption of $13,000 for independants and $5000 for dependants (Wikipedia). That exemption, although similar to the standard deduction of the current system, is the only one. The flat tax eliminates all of what Steve Forbes refers to as "the monster", all the technicalities, the deductions and brackets.

I think that everyone can agree the US federal tax system is too complex. It's really frustrating to think that a citizen can struggle simply to FOLLOW the law. The novel War and Peace looks like a brochure next to federal tax law. My only issue is whether or not flat tax is the best way to solve the problem.

It seems to me that eliminating tax brackets is not the only way to "kill the monster." If we eliminate all deductions, exemptions, and other rules... we could cut the tax system down from books to pages. In fact, a simple split into 3 tax brackets would be only three times more complicated than Forbes' flat tax, and possibly more fair to people who are hurt more by taxation. After all, even though the poor pay less under flat tax, the taxes they pay trades off more with necessities, while the taxes of the rich trade off more with luxury purchases. That said, our economy should not necessarily discourage the purchase of luxury items as that helps to give people jobs in the first place. In that regard, flat tax has a really strong potential to help everyone. I just feel that the merits of flat tax should not be judged SOLELY on it's simplicity as there are other simple tax measures to consider.

All of that said, Steve Forbes is a very talented and entertaining speaker. I hope all US citizens manage to get their stuff in. I don't want to see the IRS knocking on Massassian doors... after all, the Brute Squad is only so powerful.

Continental breakfast = donuts.

I've already sent my tax forms in and have gotten both my state and federal returns back.

Actually, I had a bagel and some fruit.

Taxes are due tomorrow for people in the northeast, because the tax processing center is in Mass., and they have a state holiday.

I didn't make enough to have to file taxes for like the 4th year in a row.

Forget income tax. National sales tax is the way to go. That way we can finally start making money off the illegal immigrants.

A flat tax would be a great thing. Everyone would pay an equal percentage regardless of income. But a flat tax happening in this nation is about as likely to happen as me running faster than light and certainly not while the neocon W is currently running things.

While Avenger and I avoided the need to pay taxes because our incomes were so low, my mom got taken to the fiscal cleaners by Uncle Sam...and we're not even rich. I hate socialism.

Edit: Props to Macfarlane. About time they actually pay SOMETHING...but that's another argument for another thread.

[QUOTE=Jedi Legend]Steve Forbes spoke in Overland Park, KS (an appropriately wealthy suburb of Kansas City). I had the opportunity to eat a continental breakfast, but, almost as importantly, I got to hear him discuss the flat tax.

The flat tax is the accountant's ultimate nightmare, a tax system that is not based on millions of words spread into a large number of books called "Tax Law". The tax that Steve Forbes advocates is not a pure flat tax, however. He envisions an exemption of $13,000 for independants and $5000 for dependants (Wikipedia). That exemption, although similar to the standard deduction of the current system, is the only one. The flat tax eliminates all of what Steve Forbes refers to as "the monster", all the technicalities, the deductions and brackets.

I think that everyone can agree the US federal tax system is too complex. It's really frustrating to think that a citizen can struggle simply to FOLLOW the law. The novel War and Peace looks like a brochure next to federal tax law. My only issue is whether or not flat tax is the best way to solve the problem.

It seems to me that eliminating tax brackets is not the only way to "kill the monster." If we eliminate all deductions, exemptions, and other rules... we could cut the tax system down from books to pages. In fact, a simple split into 3 tax brackets would be only three times more complicated than Forbes' flat tax, and possibly more fair to people who are hurt more by taxation. After all, even though the poor pay less under flat tax, the taxes they pay trades off more with necessities, while the taxes of the rich trade off more with luxury purchases. That said, our economy should not necessarily discourage the purchase of luxury items as that helps to give people jobs in the first place. In that regard, flat tax has a really strong potential to help everyone. I just feel that the merits of flat tax should not be judged SOLELY on it's simplicity as there are other simple tax measures to consider.

All of that said, Steve Forbes is a very talented and entertaining speaker. I hope all US citizens manage to get their stuff in. I don't want to see the IRS knocking on Massassian doors... after all, the Brute Squad is only so powerful.[/QUOTE]
Nice. Overland Park is nice...a little snobby, but not nearly as bad as Olathe. Sounds like you had a fun time

i could have sworn tax day was saturday.

It is the 15th, but because it was a Saturday, you have until the following Monday (today) to file.

[QUOTE=Dj Yoshi]Nice. Overland Park is nice...a little snobby, but not nearly as bad as Olathe. Sounds like you had a fun time :D[/QUOTE]

Ha. Olathe isn't snobby, not in comparison to Leawood. Plus, southwest Olathe is pretty "ghetto" ;), "ghetto" by Johnson County, KS standards. But THAT is really a debate for another community entirely.

P.S. For everyone else, I haven't read What's the Matter with KS but apparently it talks a lot about my county specifically as being... well, priveleged.

I kind of like the National Sales Tax except that unless we repeal the 16th amendment, it's going to be even LESS likely to have a National Sales tax than to have a flat tax. It would be one way to get money from overseas accounts into our economy again.

Yeah, taxes...I'll get right on that.

[QUOTE=Jedi Legend]Ha. Olathe isn't snobby, not in comparison to Leawood. Plus, southwest Olathe is pretty "ghetto" ;), "ghetto" by Johnson County, KS standards. But THAT is really a debate for another community entirely.[/QUOTE]
Olathe is very snobby, as a whole, as well as rich. There is a ghetto part, but there's a ghetto part of every town. That's my experiences there at least ;P

Swanky ***. I'm going to college in KS, someone give me some f-ing pointers. :p Kansassians I mean.

Get used to windy, dry, hot weather. Oh wait, you're going to live in Lawrence.

Get used to hot, muggy weather, and lame winters. Also lots of drugs.

I can't really help you unless you're going to KU, in which case, Lawrence is a very awesome city and you'll have no trouble finding really good pizza at Gumby's and Pizza Shuttle. If in Lawrence, you'll find lots of good places to eat on "Massachusetts" street which leads into what I'd consider "downtown" Lawrence. Yello Sub is an amazing sub sandwich place, there's one near student union. Lawrence has a decent disc golf course, if you like that. The campus is huge and has lots of hills, believe it or not, bring good walking shoes.

I very nearly went to KU. I went to a camp there for a couple of weeks one summer ago and I've been around Lawrence a few times. Lawrence is only 20 minutes away from Olathe if you follow the flow of traffic on K10, which is like 80 miles per hour.

[QUOTE=Jedi Legend]I can't really help you unless you're going to KU, in which case, Lawrence is a very awesome city and you'll have no trouble finding really good pizza at Gumby's and Pizza Shuttle. If in Lawrence, you'll find lots of good places to eat on "Massachusetts" street which leads into what I'd consider "downtown" Lawrence. Yello Sub is an amazing sub sandwich place, there's one near student union.

If you're going to Emporia... well, it smells really bad down there. The university is near a meat packing plant.

If Kansas State... I haven't been to Manhattan, but it's supposed to be ok.

Otherwise, I can't help you.[/QUOTE]
Yeah. He's going to KU.

Also, don't ever eat at Perkins. Ever.

If we eliminated the government, I bet we wouldn't have to pay taxes.





My point of view is the libertarian standard. Minimal government, minimal taxation.

Have I told you that I love you recently?

Taxation can be good. I want our colleges to be on the people's payroll, to a certain extent, without all the bureaucratic bull**** you have to go through now just to get a little governmental aid. Some things need to be socialized. Others don't.