The fate of SWG

The Rumors:
Okay, so there's been these rumors floating around for a couple of months now that Lucarts isn't renewing their license with SOE (at least, not for developing the title). It has been said that they have been shopping around for someone else to develop the game and Bioware was a leading prospect. Around this same time, the Canadian based Bioware company partnered up with the Los Angeles company, Pandemic Studios. Bioware then announces that they are opening up a new studio in Austin, TX (near SOE). A few days later Ralph Koster (original executive producer of SWG) announces that he's leaving to pursue another MMO and help start up a new game studio on his website's blog. Bioware then announces that they are going to developing a "yet to be titled" MMO set in a sci-fi genre at their new Austin, TX studio. Other rumors have been circulating that Bioware was interested in hiring ex-swg developers. Rumor has it, that Bioware will be taking over development of SWG and SOE will handle billing and customer service only.

What we DO know:
So far, SOE and Lucasart have both denied that there are any plans to "sunset" SWG (which, in and of itself, doesn't debunk the rumors). Bioware has not announced what their new "mmo" is and they have not denied the rumors that have been circulating. Development is slowing at SOE for SWG. The best they had to show off at E3 was an "Event" where ultamately they are chaning Rustuss on Rori to a battle zone (imagine if Berline had Naboo style buildings in WWII). We also know that certain members of the dev team were pulled recently from working on an upcoming expansion and that that expansion (whatever it was) has been canceled.

So, my question is:
What do you think about the possibility of Bioware taking over development of SWG?

I don't know, and I really don't care. SWG was always and still is a pretty game, but it plays like crap. I understand that giving it to a new company could change all that, but I think SWG is in a big enough hole that noone can take it out. The people who play SWG now enjoy crap games ( well, obviously if they play SWG ), so if Bioware came in and changed their game, they might get some new players, but they are going to lose more than they gain.

I don't know what Bioware can do honestly. I bet you some suit(s) are scratching their heads saying "I don't know what to do with this crap? You?"

To the four of you that voted "Yes" because of KotOR. That was an entirely different game. Different story, different UI, different engine. You can't compare Bioware's success with KotOR with the potential for SWG. Bioware has done fantastic things with NWN and KotOR but...I think SWG is beyond saving.

It would be better if a new company just scrapped it all really, beginning again from pretty much scratch.

Mind you, Bioware, I don't know. I just didn't like KotOR at all.

i liked KOTOR, and i never had an interest for SWG, so I have nothing to vote for.

although I always thought the IE games were loads better than KOTOR.

LEC representatives have also stated that they have, in fact, toyed with the idea of starting another Star Wars MMO, seperate from SWG, but that they had no plans to shut SWG down. I think there was an article on GameSpot about it.

Hmm. SWG was a fantastic idea and could have been the coolest thing since sliced bread, but everyone says it's lame and not nearly worth the fees. It's such a shame too.

This has nothing to do with SWG, but I was thinking, they should make a Rebel Assault game on the Wii. That would be hot.

Seems like that would be a silly idea.

Actually, the report was that they (LEC) had been approached by several companies to do a new Star Wars MMO. Just to clarify.

Yeah, that's different. I still think it would be a tough sell if they keep SWG up and running.

Hmmm... I smell the feint possibility of a KOTOR MMO... which would be the most succesful mmo if it was a massive version of its single player games, with out 100 loading zones here and there though

Firefly Online

I like the old SWG better than KotOR.

*shrug*

[QUOTE=Vincent Valentine]Firefly Online[/QUOTE]

Are you guessing or what?

http://www.gamespot.com/news/show_blog_entry.php?topic_id=24466266

There's the article I was referring to.

Given the way it's worded, I believe saying that they have been "toying with the idea" is perfectly appropriate.

They should remove the jedi class, and make it more of an Action RPG.

Then I'd play it. But a game where you CHOOSE to be a Jedi?

Lame beyond lame. Way to **** over your Starwars "lore."

Let's just say that I'd CREAM myself if a kotor-style Star Wars MMORPG was developed.

Nope, but KotOR still rocked.

More like wishful thinking.

What is really needed is DEUS EX WITH LIGHTSABERS.

Thank you.

I'd jump with joy if a [Star Wars + Deus Ex] title was in the works.

But it says nothings gone any further then them being approached. I'm confussed as to how that is LEC "toying with the idea."

Keep in mind, I'm not trying to nit-pick, I'm just trying to keep the fact independant of the rumors and making sure the facts are accurate.



The original system would have worked if they hadn't have given everyone 2 holocrons the following Christmas. That's what really borked that system up because all you had to do was cross-trade between servers to get the other 2 that you needed. The second system, I thought, was also good (because it actually incorporated much of the suggestion I posted for the system). In that system you could invest in becoming force-sensitive, which would add toy our own profession skills (by giving you various bonuses and such). In the OT time line, there were tons and tons of people who were attuned and sensitive to the force without actually becoming a jedi. I think the only problem with the second system for Jedi was that there were already a large portion of the community "in-the-works" to becoming Jedi. I think it would have stabalized given time. Mostly because the majority of Jedi's would get tired of constantly being hunted down by the Master Bounty Hunters and killed over and over again. So they would have just switched back over to their main, which would have been fully spected plus have a full range of force-sensitive skills.

I really don't mind there being a Jedi profession from the start. In fact, i think they should have went with this "wizards of the coast" style profession choice from the beginning. We're actually starting to see more and more commando's poping up as they tend to be better at pvp even at the lower combat levels. Hopefully, once they get finished polishing the other professions, they'll all start to balance out more.

(For the record, I respeced to Jedi after the NGE. I carry around a rifle actually deals more damage then my lightsaber AND has a range of 75 meters. I also don't wear any Jedi clothing and use my Elder Droid Engineer title to help prevent me from being stalked by Bounty Hunters.)

They said that they have been approached about future games, but as yet nothing has come of it. They didn't say that they outright refused any offers, and they didn't say that they've planned anything concrete, either. That implies that while nothing is yet official, they have, indeed, considered the idea. "Toying with", in this context, means casual consideration.

Just to clarify.

No. SWG was a failure since CU. That was it's beggining of its demise. SOE and LucasArts are just realizing that now. Ever since Jedi became unlockable, that game has gone to dust.



No.



Even though I'm understanding that you're a Jedi, I don't understand how one can still play that game.

SWG is a failure, and it is dying.

To the orignial question - If Bioware (doubtfully) picks up SWG, I will only return if they make pre-NGE or CU servers, and allow a character transfer back to my old TKA/Pike/Brawler spec.

SWG was a failure from the beginning. It wasn't Star Wars. It was EverQuest with Star Wars skins.

In terms of gameplay, there were much superior MMORPGs out there, so it doesn't win in that regard, making the Star Wars license the only selling point. But it sucked at that, too, so it really just ended up being a major suckfest.

I'd have to disagree. EQ was so much better than SWG. Also, the profession-tree system was the best thing ever out of SWG.

Probably the only good thing out of that game, though. :\

Your comment is kinda of contradictory here. You admit that the since the Jedi have become unlockable the game has gone to dust (which is exactly what I said). But you also state that the CU was the beginning of it's demise. This is contradictory because it was Christmas of 2003 when the holo's were given and everyone started grinding out preffessions to become Jedi. While the CU didn't occur until the middle of 2005...



I guess that goes to show just how split the community was on what kind of MMO they were expecting. I know about 20 different beta testers (who were on my contact list during Beta) that have come back to the game since the NGE because it was EXACTLY what we were screaming for before the game went live.



Why? Because it actually takes some skill to PvP now? Or is it because you can no longer macro-grind your profession? Or is it because you can't dabble it multi-proffessions to make a pratically invalnurable template? I'm just curious.



The game was a failure when they gave out to holo's as Christmas gifts. That was the day that changed SWG into bantha fodder. From as far as I can tell, however, there is more activity going on since the NGE then there ever was before it. Namely in the way of PvP battles. I can't tell you how much more fun it is to running towards a large group of other players with a rifle and then turn sharply to strafe them on while your guild mates run past you and finish what you started. But I guess that's a matter of taste.



No, they'll be no more "Uber" templates in SWG ever again (thank god). They are, however, allowing branches off of the main profession to allow you to specialize in certain areas of your profession, sort of like the old system. At least now, casual players (like myself) who do have "twitch" skills, are not handicapped by those who had time to tweak their "uber" template under the old system.

IMO

Simply, I don't think free holo's were the problem. Holo's were easy to get; just go to this one place on Naboo, grind for a few hours with a group, one will drop. Free holo's and holo trading wasn't the problem. I thought it was a nice christmas/veteren's reward, IMO.

However, when CU came out, there were enogh Jedi to start a commotion for other people to whine and complain about becoming Jedi. The Devs focused on the Jedi profession more than glitches in the game its self, which the majority plays. That was wrong, despite Jedi being a new profession.



We were all expecting vehicles, mounts, and other stuff from the start. We did expect a Jedi profession, but it was expected to be hard and unlockable, not a give-me-something.




No. Because literally, 90-95% of the players (at least on my server) are Jedi. PVP was never a problem. I never enjoyed it in that game anyways. And yes, I am upset that I can't dabble in my multi-prfession perspective, rather than a single minded one track peice of crap class that all other games are doing. Professions were awesome. I didn't have to reroll a character every time I got bored. And the later you get into becoming master, the harder the profession is to lose it - because you work so hard to get it. It's a natural balance to players. And it was very, very satisfying.

I'm dissappointed you think differently





10% or more quit when the CU came out on my server. Almost everyone I knew and was on my friends list quit, including me, when NGE came out. It is THAT distasteful. Also, look above for my opinion on holo's.




Nothing against you. We just have different taste. I'm an old "return pre cu servers!" veteren, and you're an ongoing "quit complaining, it's never going to happen" player. But don't mind me if I say that's the most idiotic thing I have heard all day.

I say Oblivion style Star wars RPG or MMO

The idea behind it was good, yes, but its execution was terrible. It was trying to break away from a level-based system, and yet it still relied on experience points. Grinding should have no place in a Star Wars game.

I still liked it.

Actually, you only had to have an account open for 3 days prior to Dec 25, 2003 (when the holo's were given out). The Holo's only dropped on select NPC's. These NPC's were not overly difficult, but because of their rarity, it largely reduced your chances of getting a holo. Add to this the fact that you needed to be in a combat profession to begin with...

The reason I say that that was the problem you cite around the time the CU came out, is because that incident was what caused the huge influx in Jedi. But because it took so long to sometimes figure out what your 5th profession was and because it took so long to grind up the jedi skill tree, it took until mid 2005 for you to really see how many Jedi were created due to the holo incident.



Agreed, but it was mostly coincidental to what I described above. The fact that they changed how Jedi was obtained aided to this. I think, however, that that was more of a LEC call then an SOE call and so it makes me wonder if another company takes over if things will really change...



We expected jedi to be hard to obtain because that is what we were told. But even the Beta testers realized that this would aid in the downfall of SWG. If they had started with 9 well balanced professions, it would have prevented that. The proof is in the "wizards of the coast" text based SWRPG. I know quite a few people who play it and it is rare to find groups that have more then one Jedi in them (if they have one at all). Many of us recognized this in Beta, it's unfortunate that it would be way to costly to make such a sweeping change at that point considering how overdue they were on releasing it as it was.



Oh, I love the skill trees and the ability to dabble and "reallocate" skill points where ever I wanted. The problem, however, was that it was impossible for the devs to balance. Every single patch post Pub 8 was primarily profession balance issues. With all of the possible combinations, it was too easy to exploit the system and create "uber" templates. These "uber" templates were able to solo anything in the game (including Krayt Dragon's which the devs swore would be impossible for a Jedi to even solo (or at least, a non-master)). All it took was someone with an "Uber" template and 10k credits for buffs to accomplish that. That's what I had a problem with.



Yes, and over 110 people on my friend list also left the game. But also understand that 90% of these people enjoyed exploiting the game through "uber" templates that left casual gamers absolutely completely unable to compete with. They also enjoyed spending 50% of their time AFK while their character macro grinded or did some other pre-programed task. Of maybe 70 or so on my friendlist online at any given time, only about 4 or 5 of them were actually at their computer.



Again, my problem with pre cu is from the perspective that the proffessions were simply impossible to balance because of all of the possible (exploitable) combinations. Every time they would make a balance change people would whine...at least until someone figured out the newest "uber" combination. Truthfully, I wouldn't mind going back to the old system...but only if they could roll the servers back to pre Christmas 2003. I enjoyed those times in the game. I miss running from Bestine to Wayfar. I miss doing corpse retrivals. Most of all, I think miss all of the older players that used to play (the ones in their late 20s and early 30s). Those were the days...

The only problem that would still exist is content...which has always been lacking. They started off pretty good with Monthly Story Arcs and such...but then that all faded away with them constantly trying to rebalance the profession system. The other issue I still have with the game is how easy it to instantly travel to pretty much anywhere at anytime.

On the original question: I wouldn't really see much of a point in Bioware taking over SWG. The game still suffers from the problems of it's original release. Nothing short of redoing the gameplay from scratch would fix it. Which means you might as well make a new game.

I would think that recoding the gameplay would take far less time then redeveloping all of the art assets.

Except the art sucks, too.

Not that it didn't look good for it's time, but that was years ago. They'd be better off starting from scratch. Besides, a lot of the newer additions (namely the RotS stuff) look HORRIBLE. The Starfighters have the wrong proportions, the Clone armor looks nothing like it should, and the textures are god awful. Not to mention, as previously stated, the game still suffers from problems that it had AT LAUNCH.

There are a few things that bugged me about SWG when I played the demo... like super battle droids with the wrong names on them and of different sizes... whats up with that?

This statement actually supports mine. First off, it was a vet reward. 2 holos were given to people that had accounts active for 6 months or so, another for accounts for 3 days. I thought it was a good idea, because you're right...you HAD to be a combat profession to get them, and many wern't.



I thought that Jedi should be a rareity unlockable, maybe 3 or 4 people being Jedi on a server that has played over two years.



I believe SOE will claim rights to final decisions if LEC drops and they get a new company.




They should have focused less on Jedi and more on balancing the professions.





Uhh...Blizzard has been balancing classes in World of Warcraft -- still today, and all through this summer. MMORPG's will NEVER be truely balanced; and it is better that way for the most part.



Doesn't matter if they had what you call, an "uber templete exploitation", they left the game. I think it's a good idea to have those templetes sometimes. And Macro grinding -- SOE devs made Macros possible, so it wasn't an exploit per se. However, it is a very fine line to becomming illegal macro grinding.



Agreed.

That's true. It seems like one of the devs was working on upgrading the character model graphics, but then he go pulled from the project about 2 months ago. <shrug>

I guess I'm just not looking forward to the postpartum depression I'll have when I cancel my account...

RIP
Jon'a'than Bewil
Bloodfin - Jedi CL 70

No. When they gave out the holo's there was some bug and some people did not get them. Their solution? Fix it and give them out again. The people that got a holo the first time got another when they gave out holo's again as their "solution."

There was no "vet reward." Unless being signed up for 3 days made you a vet.