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ForumsDiscussion Forum → The U.S. National Debt is Actually $50 Trillion?
The U.S. National Debt is Actually $50 Trillion?
2007-01-05, 5:18 PM #1
I will add a disclaimer right here: I am not an expert on this subject, and I don't know if all of this is true, but needless to say, I find the prospect of it being true extremely alarming.

Right, that said:
The U.S. Debt is $50 Trillion (Blog source)
Quote:
Though the Bush Administration's official budget lists the national debt and deficit as being incredibly high, they are actually far worse than reported, according to Rep. Jim Cooper (D-TN)....The true national debt is $50 trillion, not the $8.3 trillion Bush reported. That's $156,000 for every citizen, or $375,000 for every working American. This figure has more than doubled in the past five years. We paid $327 billion last year on interest alone.


and this:
Congressman Jim Cooper's Report
Quote:
The Budget says the deficit was $319 billion in 2005 while the Financial Report says it was $760 billion, or over twice as large.

David Walker, Comptroller General of the United States, has been clear on the question of cash basis accounting. “Continuing on this unsustainable path will gradually erode, if not suddenly damage, our economy, our standard of living, and ultimately our national security.”


These are also very important links:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/23/AR2006122300653.html
Quote:
The Government Accountability Office is working with the Concord Coalition, the Brookings Institution, the Heritage Foundation and others to help educate the public about the facts in a professional, nonpartisan way. We hope the media and other opinion leaders do their part to save the future for our children and grandchildren.

DAVID M. WALKER

Comptroller General of the United States

Government Accountability Office

Washington


http://www.theconservativevoice.com/article/17140.html
Quote:
Although federal law compels the U.S. Treasury to publish the “official” annual report for the United States, it is clear they do not want you to read it. That is why the 2005 report was released during the Christmas holiday, without any press conference and distributed to only a handful of top government officials. There was no media coverage. In fact, very few people in government even know it exists, much less what is in it....Some of the most surprising findings of the report include:

*The true deficit was $760 billion, not the $318.5 billion that is usually reported-- a whopping $441.5 billion difference. It is also not 2.6% of Gross Domestic Product and shrinking, as we are frequently told, but 6.2% and growing rapidly.

*Your share of the national debit is $375,000. This has more than doubled during the five years of the Bush Administration.

*America’s debts and commitments total $49 trillion, and NOT the $8.3 trillion as commonly reported. And, they have doubled in the last five years.

*Our government paid $327 billion in interest in 2005 just to carry the debts we already have, without making any effort to reduce them. This was money that could not be spent on schools, parks, roads, or homeland security because it had to satisfy our creditors.

*During the last five years, President Bush has borrowed more money abroad than all previous American presidents combined.

It is important to note that the material in FINANCIAL REPORT OF THE UNITED STATES is not a partisan attack; this is the actual official document of the government issued by the Bush Administration itself.

FINANCIAL REPORT OF THE UNITED STATES is the only book that uses modern accounting to give you the answers to your questions about America’s financial position.

“Every businessman and woman in America knows the importance of keeping honest books. If they budgeted the way the U.S. Government does, they’d be in jail,” says Congressman Cooper.



I don't want a debate with anyone (I'm not really arguing anything) I just want to point this out to anyone who's not aware. Because if this is true, I'm pretty worried right now.

- Daft
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2007-01-05, 5:25 PM #2
Well then.

I remember when people will scared when Reagan took office that the national debt will reach, omg, 3 trillionz because of his budget (more specifically, tax) reforms.

Oh hell, who am I kidding, I was born AFTER he left his presidency. :gbkxmas:

(then a few years later in my life Bush took office, and then...)
2007-01-05, 5:55 PM #3
Is there even 50 trillion dollars in the entire world? I mean, wtf...
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2007-01-05, 5:58 PM #4
50 trillion? That sounds hard to believe. I don't think the whole US is worth that. The numbers just don't add up. Besides, I wouldn't believe anything from that first link.

And the link in from the Washington post looks like a commercial.
2007-01-05, 5:59 PM #5
It was 6 trillion 2-3 years ago.

For those who don't know, trillion is about the length of $10 dollar bills side by side all the way to the moon and back. Or so they say!
2007-01-05, 6:04 PM #6
Quote:
*America’s debts and commitments total $49 trillion, and NOT the $8.3 trillion as commonly reported. And, they have doubled in the last five years.

I'm not quite sure what is meant by commitments, but either way, the situation is quite dire. Also, keep in mind, debt is not the same as deficit.
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2007-01-05, 6:14 PM #7
That sounds extremely high, as trillion is an extremely large number.

1 million seconds ago was about 12 days ago, 1 billion seconds ago, the Watergate trial was going on, and 1 trillion seconds ago humans were entering N. America.
omnia mea mecum porto
2007-01-05, 8:20 PM #8
Who would even extend us this much credit? Who has this much to lend us? What would we spend it on? 7 Trillion I can see. 50, no.


My guess: Someone wanted to come up with some shocker to sell books and made some stupidly high estimation of what things like the war in Iraq will have cost us in 100 years or something.
2007-01-05, 9:04 PM #9
Uh, I'm no economist, but I think you're misunderstanding how this actually works, Obi_Kwiet. A national debt isn't an amount one country is going to receive from another country under percentage; it's the cumulitative amount of money it owes to all the other countries of the world. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
幻術
2007-01-05, 9:25 PM #10
No you're basically right. The U.S. National Debt alone in it's strictest sense is definitely not 50 trillion dollars, that's insanity... It's probably an estimate of the value of the services and imports and military obligations etc etc etc that the US has w/ other countries in total.

And still... damn.
2007-01-05, 9:56 PM #11
Debt can also be used to create capital, such as bonds and other investments. I'm sure that's a big hunk of the debt right there.
It took a while for you to find me; I was hiding in the lime tree.
2007-01-05, 10:22 PM #12
If we wouldn't have had jackasses (primarily Nixon and FDR) who took us off the gold-backed dollar, we wouldn't be in this problem, at least when it comes to the ability for the US to print unlimited claims to loan out and such.

Then again, if those two wouldn't of done it, someone probably would've. I'm sure Bush would've been tempted to do it when we went into the war.
"His Will Was Set, And Only Death Would Break It"

"None knows what the new day shall bring him"
2007-01-06, 12:04 AM #13
I thought everyone was in debt to America, not vice versa.

Damn you Americans are nuts.
Star Wars: TODOA | DXN - Deus Ex: Nihilum
2007-01-06, 8:45 AM #14
Originally posted by Koobie:
Uh, I'm no economist, but I think you're misunderstanding how this actually works, Obi_Kwiet. A national debt isn't an amount one country is going to receive from another country under percentage; it's the cumulitative amount of money it owes to all the other countries of the world. Please correct me if I'm wrong.



I know. How stupid would a country have to be to allow us to have that much stuff/money/service with out getting paid first?


Originally posted by mscbuck:
If we wouldn't have had jackasses (primarily Nixon and FDR) who took us off the gold-backed dollar, we wouldn't be in this problem, at least when it comes to the ability for the US to print unlimited claims to loan out and such.

Then again, if those two wouldn't of done it, someone probably would've. I'm sure Bush would've been tempted to do it when we went into the war.


That and who ever made the desecion to stop have a balanced budget. Was that carter?
2007-01-06, 10:24 AM #15
I'm happy the Canadian government mainly owes its debt to the Canadian citizenry.
2007-01-06, 10:45 AM #16
I don't understand the big deal though. Almost every country has a debt, and it's actually good for a country to have a debt.

It's fine as long as the country keeps track of what it's doing with the money and doesn't let it just spiral out of control on useless stuff.
2007-01-06, 11:07 AM #17
[QUOTE=Cool Matty]I don't understand the big deal though. Almost every country has a debt, and it's actually good for a country to have a debt.[/QUOTE]
:eek:

[QUOTE=Cool Matty]It's fine as long as the country keeps track of what it's doing with the money and doesn't let it just spiral out of control on useless stuff.[/QUOTE]
If $10, $15, or $50 whatever trillion isn't "spiralling out of control" then what is?
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2007-01-06, 11:55 AM #18
Simple, I don't see where the 50 trillion number is coming from. Period. I don't see how we could even spend that sort of money in a year, war or no.
2007-01-06, 11:57 AM #19
Isn't it $50 trillion total, not each year?
COUCHMAN IS BACK BABY
2007-01-06, 12:05 PM #20
Right, but according to the sources up there, the debt went from 1-3 trillion or whatever to 50 trillion, in one year. I mean, wth?
2007-01-06, 12:07 PM #21
I don't think that's possible

:gbkxmas:
2007-01-06, 12:35 PM #22
Especially since this "war" is only costing us 300 billion so far. It's a pretty cheap war, because were not really buying or producing new vehicles, just replacing a little ammo.
2007-01-06, 2:34 PM #23
[QUOTE=Cool Matty]Simple, I don't see where the 50 trillion number is coming from. Period. I don't see how we could even spend that sort of money in a year, war or no.[/QUOTE]
You're missing the point of what I just said. It doesn't matter if it's 5 trillion or 50 trillion, the U.S. debt is extremely high and getting higher at an increasingly rapid rate, and it is something that not only the Adminstration has lied about, but it is also going to screw us and future generations over big time unless a dramatic refiguring of the federal budget happens, and soon!
My JK Level Design | 2005 JK Hub Level Pack (Plexus) | Massassi Levels
2007-01-06, 2:39 PM #24
It doesn't get bigger at an increasingly rapid rate. It gets bigger because there's a war going on. That, and the country is always growing in population...

And yes, I'd venture to say that 5 trillion is actually a very manageable number, while 50 trillion is not.

You act like the debt is gonna send us under and be our ultimate doom. It's not nearly as big of a worry as, say, a terrorist nuclear attack >.>

When in doubt, WIKIPEDIA! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Debt_by_U.S_presidential_terms
2007-01-06, 2:50 PM #25
I love how the US presidency averages out to DD/RR/DD/RR/DD/RR/DD/RR.

FORD CARTER REAGAN BUSH. GET IT?

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