It's long, but he says insightful things about religion, atheism, and our nation as it relates to faith that you won't hear out of most people in America, let alone out of any of the other candidates.

[Transcribed]

Could you summarize?

Here we go again...

No, this shouldn't be an argument. I just want to talk about the speech. He's not just talking to democrats, he's talking to religious and non-religious people.

I'll summarize with a few quotes (from Digg), but the whole thing is really worth a listen:



He goes on to describe that he's a very skeptical Christian. He explains why it is valuable to both the church and the state to separate them.





He also explains why faith-based values have to be justified to everyone in order to become law in America.

Why do people keep making abortion a religious thing? The bible says nothing about abortion specifically, and everyone agrees that human life should be protected. The issue is weather or not a fetus is a human. If it is, we should protect them, if not it doesn't matter.

No complaints from me. He's pretty spot on (judging from the quotes Kirby posted).

Obi: Yeah, very true.

That was a brilliant speech.

That speech makes me like Obama a lot more than I did.

He seems to me to have a good understanding of a few different angles as far as religion is concerned, which is nice, because as is clear from this speech it makes him far more tolerant of people of non-christian faith (or non-faith entirely). It's refreshing to see a candidate that doesn't just assume that everyone else has the exact same moral principles as laid out in the Bible.

I like that he sees faith as a personal issue, and it wasn't hard to catch that he has some disdain for the "OMG LOOK AT ME IM A CHRISTIAN LOOK LOOK (SEND MONEY)" megachurches. And he seems to be spot-on in terms of separation of church and state, in that nobody is asking for all politicians to be atheist or something crazy like that, just that an appeal to God's Will is not a suitable way to determine policy. Which ties in with the "faith should be personal" thing that he believes.

I'm an atheist, but I have absolutely no problem with living in a country run by Christians (or Muslims, or Buddhists, or even bloody Scientologists), as long as they're like Obama and won't try to legislate their religious beliefs into law.

Yes, as an atheist, I don't think I've ever been spoken to specifically by a politician, more than I was in that speech.

^ This.

Good speech.

This is how I feel as well.

Obama really has yet to disappoint me.

Because it directly interferes with how some religions view existence. Some people believe that abortion deprives some people of coming to earth.

I can't say whether or not it is specifically mentioned in the bible but it could be considered murder

Yeah, the problem is that "thou shalt not kill" is rather... open to interpretation.

I'd rather not turn this into an abortion thread, but whatever:

I'm personally pro-life. I have a very hard time justifying abortion in any case other than rape or physical danger. While I could never make this decision for anyone else, I personally could not bear my child being aborted for any reason whatsoever, and I have a hard time agreeing with the defense that it'd be her choice alone in the matter.

That said, I believe in pro-choice politics with a strong social support for women who may have difficulties raising a child. 2 years of government paid leave, child care support, and education related to the dangers of an abortion. I think that providing women with an alternative to abortion that results in a healthy mother AND a healthy baby is ideal. The reason why I still support pro-choice is that back-ally abortions may result in the death of the mother and the child both; an absolute waste of life simply because of a morally based law that doesn't consider the realities of the situation.

So with a socialist child care system, you'll have less women having abortions. The percent of women who still wish to be rid of the child in their womb would have access to medically safe (however immoral) abortions. This ultimately results in LESS deaths than banning abortion all together.

That's how I see the issue, and how I think any reasonable pro-lifer should see the issue. If you can honestly say you'd rather have women and child dying through back-ally abortions, than you're really misguided in your idea of what "life" and being "pro" means.

You have to be careful with socialist health care systems. I personally can't stand our health care or pharmaceutical industries, but I don't really agree with going completely socialized either.

I know that's veering off topic too. I like Obama and I think that speech was fantastic. I also like how he's appealing to an audience that's more often than not overlooked. It helps that I happen to be in the audience.

No, it's WISE BEARD MAN

i know it might have been obvious, but seriously, if you're talking about obama, say you're talking about obama. it took 6 posts for his name to show up.

Note;

These religions think abortion and masturbation are about as equally as bad.

Except when you jerk it you're wasting millions of lives instead of one.

The title of the thread is 'the wisest candidate by far'. It isn't exactly going to be about Ron Paul.

Perhaps not but it's a lot more likely that it'd be about Hillary, so we were confused.

Hahahha.

You've been on a roll lately.

From SA

Wow it's been a long time since I've been on Massassi. Anyway, as a US citizen I like Obama and voted for him in the California primary. So like most of you I agree that he is a fine candidate. However, as a Christian I find only fitting that I attempt to comment on a rather inaccurate theological statement that was mentioned "These religions think abortion and masturbation are about as equally as bad."

In no way could someone make this assumption as the bible never expresses such a statement. Man hasn't been given a list that expresses how bad each sin is compared to another. The most we can infer comes from a statement in the bible that explains that all sins are offensive in God's eyes and separate one from from having the perfect relationship with the The Lord which would occur in heaven. So in that manner all sins can be viewed as equal in terms of their major consequence. However, as Jesus paid for such crimes anyone who remembers and believes will be able to have such a relationship with God in heaven despite their past.

Anyway, as for abortion the word of God does not explicitly say much about it. Most Christian pro life supporters quote a verse in Jeremiah 1: 5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart." Some believe that this shows that God has created each unborn child and cares for them as any other man or woman. I can't say with absolute certainty that these unborn children have souls but I definitely wouldn't want to be part of it if turned out they did.

I like it. I must admit that I voted for Obama without extensively reviewing his positions, but the more I learn the more satisfied I am with my choice.

The broad appeal of this speech actually reminds a bit of his speech to the Democratic National Convention back in '04. That was the first I'd ever heard of Obama, but the first thing I did after listening to it was ask when he would be old enough to run for president.

He's hope.