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ForumsDiscussion Forum → More paintball...
More paintball...
2009-09-21, 7:53 AM #1
I posted a thread a while ago about how I was getting totally obsessed with paintball. Well I ended up buying a bunch of gear, including a gun called a Proto Matrix Rail. These things have circuit boards in them that control the rate of fire and firing mode, as well as "eyes" that ensure a paintball is ready to go before it lets the fun fire. This, combined with an electronic force-feed hopper (I first bought a viewloader vlocity but it sucked so I returned it and got a dye rotor) allows my gun to shoot something like 30 balls per second. I set the mode to 20 balls per second (some people say the higher rate of fire can break balls, so I wanted to start a bit slower) and went out to the field yesterday.

Holy crap.

It literally shoots so fast it looks like a rope of paint hanging out of my barrel. I just couldn't believe how fast it was shooting -- the very first game (only ~ 6 minutes) I went through 500 balls (I've made 500 last through an entire day before).

Anyway, throughout the whole day, having full auto only helped me get a single kill. It was when a guy was running between some trees in the woods, I just laid some paint out in front of him -- way easier than trying to land a single shot. However, the rest of the time I just used it for suppressing fire. I went through a case of 2000 then left before they closed because I didn't want to spend more money on paint.

It was a total blast, if any of you haven't tried paintball before, you should go try it. It's like a video game, but better.

Speaking of that, some kid came up to me during one of the breaks and asked me, "What map are we playing on next?" I literally had to use all my mental strength to not start laughing out loud. My next thought was to say "dm4" but he probably wouldn't have understood the reference.
2009-09-21, 7:55 AM #2
You should've said Oasis NF.

or 6000 Block
2009-09-21, 8:57 AM #3
My local fields don't allow full auto, any marker with that capability also has to have a semi-auto mode.

I typically do 1000 rounds for a full day, and while I can carry six to eight hundred rounds on me in pods I don't like having to use them.
$do || ! $do ; try
try: command not found
Ye Olde Galactic Empire Mission Editor (X-wing, TIE, XvT/BoP, XWA)
2009-09-21, 10:20 AM #4
6000 block is the correct answer. Or 5600 block if you want to go way back (that was the number, wasn't it?)
Life is beautiful.
2009-09-21, 10:33 AM #5
Yes, Brian was using that number scheme while ATI and nVidia were in their infancy.
Bassoon, n. A brazen instrument into which a fool blows out his brains.
2009-09-21, 3:19 PM #6
I only need 2 balls.
2009-09-21, 4:31 PM #7
Originally posted by Darkjedibob:
My local fields don't allow full auto, any marker with that capability also has to have a semi-auto mode.

I typically do 1000 rounds for a full day, and while I can carry six to eight hundred rounds on me in pods I don't like having to use them.
I normally just use semi, but I got a new gun, can you blame me? They have no restrictions on bps or firing modes, one guy has a double barrel that he custom made, what a crackup. They don't allow bunkering (shooting at someone within ~16 feet or something) unless you give them the opportunity to surrender. Maybe that's why they're not too concerned about getting overshot. They also will kick you out if you overshoot too much (more than 3 balls on a single person). I really try not to hurt anyone, sometimes at my own expense (I stop shooting if I see a ball hit, even if I couldn't tell for sure if it broke).

The full auto on this gun has some sort of ramping. You have to manually shoot 3 balls in quick succession before you can hold down the trigger and have it shoot full auto. I don't know why they do that, it seems silly. I'd rather be able to just put it in full full full auto (just hold down the trigger and shoot till I run out).
2009-09-21, 4:32 PM #8
I know how you feel. I own an '06 Angel Speed and that thing flies. I always shoot AT LEAST one case every time I go out. Of course, I play speed ball which is a bit different.
2009-09-21, 4:34 PM #9
Originally posted by Rogue Leader:
6000 block is the correct answer. Or 5600 block if you want to go way back (that was the number, wasn't it?)


There is a story behind the names and the layout of the levels. If you look from top view both 5600 & 6000 have the same basic layout. 4 buildings, each occupying a corner of a large square. The buildings are L shaped. When I just joined the AF I was just learning about computers and I played a demo of JK. Went out and bought a new computer so it would run better. Then when I discovered JED I basically laid out the level the same as the dorms I was living in. Except there was no huge tower in the center of the dorm buildings, just some weeds and ****.
2009-09-21, 4:40 PM #10
Originally posted by Trigger Happy Chewie:
I know how you feel. I own an '06 Angel Speed and that thing flies. I always shoot AT LEAST one case every time I go out. Of course, I play speed ball which is a bit different.


I went for the proto rail because of the midrange price and really good reviews. Also there are a couple of people at my local park that have them (and a lot of dye owners) so I figured if I needed help someone would be around.

About 9 years ago I went paintballing at a different field a few times and they had a pure speedball course. I thought it was tons of fun because the games are fast and people move. Where I go there are a mix of young beginners who are very timid and then older people (like 40+). The older people aren't as timid but they know the field layout and have favorite bunkers that they get to and then camp. It's hard to oust them w/out a concerted team effort. Which, of course, everyone is either too timid or too set in their ways to try. The bunkers in the small fields here are basically spools and plywood structures with a couple of inflatable ones thrown in.

There are two other fields fairly close by that I want to try. One has an urban course which sounds rad. The other one is more focused on teams so I will probably get my *** kicked. I will go to one of those next.

They are doing an event here in about a month -- maybe I can convince Grismath to show up. It's called alien insurrection or something, and they put 25 or so of the most experienced guys with the best equipment against everyone else (~150). Sounds interesting (I bet the field makes a ton of money on paint that day).

Speaking of which, any idea what the markup on a case of paint is? I'm seriously considering opening an indoor paintball park, I think it would be fun, but I don't know enough about the biz quite yet to estimate costs.
2009-09-21, 7:34 PM #11
No one around here plays paintball. Makes me sad, my Custom 98 is going to waste :(
I had a blog. It sucked.
2009-09-22, 12:40 AM #12
Originally posted by Brian:
Speaking of which, any idea what the markup on a case of paint is? I'm seriously considering opening an indoor paintball park, I think it would be fun, but I don't know enough about the biz quite yet to estimate costs.


Please move back to England.
2009-09-22, 7:17 AM #13
Originally posted by Martyn:
Please move back to England.


I don't understand your comment.
2009-09-22, 7:46 AM #14
Because then you can open an indoor paintball arena HERE, and I can play there.
2009-09-22, 7:49 AM #15
Ah, okay, perhaps I am misunderstanding but in order to move back, doesn't that imply that I once lived there?

As an alternative, you can move to the Seattle area. The weather is similar but instead of speaking with a funny accent and saying "cheers" a lot, we begin all of our sentences with "So..." and 90% of the population says the word "like" at least 3 times in every sentence.
2009-09-22, 7:58 AM #16
^^^I thought you served here for a while in the Air Force?

Also, Seattle sounds nice. So, I may like have to do some convincing with the wife though. <_<
2009-09-22, 8:11 AM #17
Just for a couple of months. I was living in these trailer things with a bunch of other dudes so that doesn't sound like the best thing ever to me.

Anyway, I'm seriously considering getting out of programming for a living. There's a circuit city building here that's right in the middle of town and vacant. I wonder what they charge for the lease. That would totally kick *** to run a field. I just don't know about finances.

For example, the field I go to probably hosts an average of ~100 people per week. Probably 70% are people renting gear for $40/person. The rest have their own gear and pay $15 per day field fee. I'm 100% sure we'd get at least that many people each week if I ran the place. So just on rentals/field fee we're talking about 2800 + 450...

ack ferry landing, gotta bail, will finish thoughts later
2009-09-22, 8:15 AM #18
If the idea were food I'd say (and I think I'm not alone here) EAT IT.

Hence, because this is not food, but an enterprise, I'm gonna go with DO IT.

(seriously, it sounds like a great idea if the crowds keep coming)
2009-09-22, 8:33 AM #19
I'd show up if I was in the area. I would love to have an indoor arena, it's better than playing in 90° and 95-100% humidity.

As for paint markup, I'm not sure. When I worked at a field we had "white box", which we sold for $30 a case, and just about everything else was around $60, but I don't know how much we were getting them for.

If you're up for it, I say go for it.
$do || ! $do ; try
try: command not found
Ye Olde Galactic Empire Mission Editor (X-wing, TIE, XvT/BoP, XWA)
2009-09-22, 8:37 AM #20
Originally posted by Darkjedibob:
it's better than playing in 90° and 95-100% humidity.

florida tag

:suicide:
Bassoon, n. A brazen instrument into which a fool blows out his brains.
2009-09-23, 7:52 AM #21
So anyway, my thoughts were (2800 + 450) * 4 weeks = 13k/month in rental/field fee revenue. On top of that is paint, probably 40% of people I see at the local park buy a full case at $65.00. Other fields around here sell cases for $55 or so. They say they make most of their money on paint, and I know they sell at walmart for 30/case, so pretend there's a $30 per case markup on the field paint, so that's 30 bucks * 40 cases (per week) * 4 weeks = 4800 each month for paint. So revenue is about $17,800 per month assuming my numbers on paint are somewhere in the ballpark (I bet they are low) and assuming I can get 100 people in per week.

Then there are expenses -- there are a lot of empty buildings around here due to the recession so may be I can lease one for 8000/month that's big enough for two fields and a decent staging area. Then there is water, heating, electricity, paying a gun tech to be in attendance to manage rental guns, etc.

However, since it's indoor, I bet I can get more people than just 100/week coming. I'm going to go visit the other paintball fields in the area to try to gauge how many people go to them. I have the feeling the one I go to is the most crowded, but I could be wrong.

I think having an indoor park in this area would rock because we get rain 9 months out of the year and it's miserable to play in the rain. Also, we could have a real speedball field and then a small scenario field with movable obstacles (so we could change it up often).

I found a really cool article here:

http://www.scubatoys.com/paintball/starting-a-paintball-field/Foreword.asp

However, it's not all the way finished yet.

Anyway, with no up-front building costs, then say a $10,000 build-out for nets, walls to separate the fields, making the staging area, observation room, etc., then another say $10,000 for all the gear a place needs (rental guns, compressors, bunkers, astroturf, etc.), it seems easy to make that back with ~$7k profit (on the low side) per month.

The article I mentioned suggests buying a building, but that isn't too thrilling for me. If I could get a shorter term lease, if things work out, I won't mind paying extra for rent, also, if things work out, I could quickly move to a new location if needed. There is plenty of property around here.
2009-09-23, 10:11 AM #22
Indoor can be hard, because you are spending a lot of your cash on rent and heat if you don't get the customers. The outdoor fields can survive longer with no customers. You can't. This is what happened to a local indoor field here. No one was playing PB for a while and they had to close shop and the outdoor fields didn't.


But if you did open your own field, that would be AWESOME.

You would have to have a huge massassian game before opening to the public.
2009-09-23, 10:21 AM #23
Yeah, if I can't get customers w/in a few months, I guess the chances of it being a good long-term business aren't that great (so if it went belly up I wouldn't mind) -- I guess I'd like to have at least 3-6 months in reserves to find out if it's a viable business. A lot of money to lose but I wouldn't try it until I was able to really justify the investment.

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