I concede that there's nothing w/in the articles that I've read that proves that these kids are tea-baggers or that their parents are tea-baggers (I've already said this). I apologize for derailing a thread whose subject should be about 1st amendment rights for children & not what the purpose of their statement was. Please accept this as an opportunity to get the thread back on track.

I think it's funny when I see silly kids wearing their Che Guevara communism shirt that they bought at the Hot Topic in the City Center Shopping Mall.

In my classes we used to call shopping malls "capitalist churches."

Can most of us agree that 1) the kids were wearing the shirts just to be dicks, and 2) the assistant principal should have just let them?

Goddamn kids.

When I have kids, the two words they will say the most will be "yes" and "sir."

Yeah, that's pretty much my position but in a more efficient matter.

Seriously. If these teenagers a few doors down keep waking up my wife at midnight w/ their rap music I'm going to go vigilante & slash their ****ing tires.

They deserved it just as anyone being an ******* deserves it.

I'm in need of a little history lesson from the Americans here:

Did the Confederation stand for anything decent? It always seems to come off as a cluster**** of racism, bigotry and regressiveness, but there seem to be a lot of people who relate to the cause, and because those people aren't universally regarded as idiots I figure there must have been something there beneath this image of a melting pot of **** that I have of the Confederation. I know they opposed the idea of being joined into the federation, maybe that's the main attraction for varying reasons?

My personal summary of the thread:

So if I ever go to the United States of America, would I be allowed to wear a Soviet flag on the 4th of July?

Yes.

But you can expect to get sent home from school for it.

Not that I would, naturally.

OK, to take a slightly serious approach, for me to have done (had done so deliberately, at least) so would have been stupid and disrespectful - and if I were given the right to be "officially offended," I suppose it would be anything but a lesson well learned (for everybody, really).

Am I making any sense?

Simplification (I don't know a lot about the civil war): They didn't oppose the idea of being joined into the USA, they were already a part of the USA and wanted to leave it. They wanted to leave because they felt that the northern states were oppressing them and using the federal government to override the southern states' rights and sovereignty. The issue in question was, as you know, whether or not slavery should be legal. This was generally at the core of every other issue. A good analogy is the healthcare debate in the US these days: it's about healthcare, but it's also about states' rights, taxation, spending, etc.

Did they stand for anything decent? Yes, I think so. But for all the wrong reasons, and in all the wrong ways. I think it's unfortunate that the important matter of states' rights had to come to a head over an issue which is so clearly one-sided.

Nope.

No one has school on July 4th, dummy.

Not really. Are you saying that there should be repercussions for wearing a Soviet flag on the 4th of July?

And now for something completely different.

Not saying there should be. I'm saying there will be (not necessarily "official," but the chance for uncomfortable situations would most dramatically increase). And that makes perfect sense. Why in the world would wearing the USA flag in your country on your own national holiday lead to repercussions is beyond me.

But anyhow, I suppose it would have to be the flag of the United Kingdom, and not the Soviet flag, that would supposedly offend the most on the 4th of July.

Dont you know? americans have no rights until they are 18! at least thats what i was told every time i exercised my supposed freedom of speech in high school....

Firstly, thanks to Bob for the recap, and secondly...



The Soviet one would probably offend an endless amount more people regardless of your valid point about the history of American independence.

And everyone it offended is an idiot.

Actually, other than the slavery thing, the Confederation had a LOT going for them. They actually instituted some pretty damn good laws compared to the Union at that time. It was very states right however, so if you don't believe in states rights, then you probably weren't for the Confederate Constitution. For instance they banned the use of using tax revenue from one state and using it to spend in another. There were more provisions as well to make sure that money was spent in the right places (actually I believe in their constitution they designated those certain times). Plus you could argue that the states should have the right to secede if they want to :/. Also in the Confederacy states could vote to impeach federal judges and appointed posititions within the state. However they did adopt line-item vetoes as well, which in my opinion are very very stupid.

Check out a whole list here: http://www.filibustercartoons.com/CSA.htm

In the Confederacy's defense, they did have some good ideas :/. Those who thinks it's awesome that the government for instance taxes everyone in the country to build something in one state probably wouldn't like it. The slavery thing though kind of overshadowed it all, and they had no problem using the term slavery in their constitution and making sure that was in it.

The straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak, was the government's policy about containing slavery. The federal government had no intention of banning slavery in existing slave-owning states, but they did prohibit the use of slave labor in the new territories (Texas in particular.) This, in addition to the rapid industrialization of the north, threatened the economic power of wealthy southern slave owners and motivated them to secede. The Confederacy was an immensely dishonest, greedy, selfish and evil enterprise, and their arguments and sentiments are used in pretty much the same ways today.

There are no good analogies for it, but the healthcare debate is pretty much on the bottom of the list.

Why were students marching through the city, exactly? I missed that when I first saw the thread.

(that's in reference to the march, btw not carl-ing the mis-link). but whatever, they can do what they want. Perhaps the marchers would like me to call whine-1-1 for them

yeah i heard that too.. teachers and school administrators love to make **** up to justify giving students ****