To be fair I've never lost anything! It's all laziness!

BM:S will never come out, deal wit it.

Didn't the massassi community pull together the money for VB4?

I've offered my assistance many times. I have quite a bit of vb and ci experience.

Oh come on it's been there since who knows when!

Still waiting for new updates, though! P:

I don't recall getting a PM when I asked

Also, the VB4 money wasn't put to waste. It was needed anyway, for security upgrades or otherwise.

Besides, I've had offers for help before, they fell through What I really needed was someone with design skill, and no one really came up with anything (except Geb, who I must give credit for at least trying).

I'm glad I donated money for something, then Matty spent it on something else.

I can't tell if you are joking or not.

I didn't recall either. Then I just went through my sent messages, and indeed I did PM you.

sounds like every other government/charitable organization...

My bad then

Still need a designer though, otherwise no point. (And that might have been the hangup back then, but let's be honest, that was a while ago)

BTW, in case Steven WASN'T joking: VB4 was indeed purchased, we had no choice if we wanted security updates for VB3.

Sadly, at best, I have a minimalist aesthetic not many people like, and at more realistically, I suck. But yes, it's totally the intent that counts!

Well I consider myself a designer, may not be my strongest skill but I'm pretty good at taking a psd and building an html template

Then by all means go find that old stickied thread and have a whack at it

Here's the old thread CM is talking about.

Geb what design did you come up with? (Or is that the current massassi.net/2/)

Somebody should update that page, it's looking a little dated...:neckbeard:

Naw, nothing used. I'm not sure if I have it anymore, but it was just a MSPaint mockup of what the front/main page might look like. Pretty shoddy stuff, really, but I also did it in, like, 5 minutes. It was meant mostly to just be a "is this anything close to what you had in mind?" and when the answer was "no" I was lost on what else to come up with at the time. Trust me, you're not missing anything.

BM:S demonstrates everything I hate about the mod community. You have so much done, stop waiting for the last 10% and release it now! You can always keep working on it and finish it! Just think, if the DFMod hadn't released that 6-level demo, we wouldn't have gotten to play ANY of it.

What, incremental releases? NO, IT MUST ONLY BE SEEN IN ITS ABSOLUTE PERFECTION AS ITS DESIGNERS ENVISIONED IN OPIATE INDUCED DREAMS

Nobody learned anything from DNF, I expected after it's failure that lots of these mods would suddenly come out when the devs realized how dumb they were.

IT MUST BE PIXEL PERFECT.

XHTML COMPLIANT

HTML5

That assumes they have more work done than what they've taken screenshots of.

The reason I hate the mod community is because of bad leadership.

Most mod projects are run by a clueless little "idea person." i.e. people who think they are qualified to design games because the amount of time they spend playing games has precluded them from developing any real skills (including the social ones.)
Without that critical amount of experience - especially in software development - none of their ideas are grounded in reality. Even if they luck out and pick something plausible, their lazy social choices inevitably leads to failure (and with a volunteer project you can't even force people to work by fiat.)

I'm not talking about projects that fizzle, like people just lose interest in it or realize it's a bad idea. I'm talking about critical failure via obscenely stupid leadership choices, like - to use an examples from the same high-profile JK mod - a token ring approach to level design or the project leader delegating project leadership.


By comparison to some of the **** I've seen in the JK community, BM:S is incredibly well-run. I don't know if it'll ever come out, but I know that Valve will be legally forced to either buy the project or issue a C&D if it's ever released. If BM:S is good enough, there's a great chance that their story will have a good ending.

...DNF? :p

I imagine there were many poor leadership choices behind DNF but the decision to release it "when it's done" is not one of them. The most basic decision you make when you're working on a game is whether you're willing to compromise on the schedule or compromise on the feature set.

Exercise: The developers of Morrowind and Ocarina of Time also made this decision. Which choice did they make? Would the alternative have been better?

And in spite of JM's misdirected rage there is rarely a playable game until after that "last 10%" is finished. Unless you have a retarded amount of experience designing games you can't even guess if your game is going to be fun until it's totally finished. That's why game design is hard. That's why even Shiggy can turn out stinkers and why "game design" degrees are worthless.

Yes but in this case, at least to my knowledge, the last 10% of BM:S is probably a few levels or some polish. They already have the mechanics exactly correct. It's just reproducing levels, isn't it?

1.) Black Mesa Source is a very special case. In general the last 10% is all of the integration work.
2.) All of the levels are tiny and they all use the same assets, so the last 10% will be 10% of everything. It does not mean that 10% of the levels are missing.
3.) BM:S has never given any release date or any indication of their progress. So far they've released a bunch of cherry-picked screenshots and 20 seconds of heavily-edited gameplay footage. Claiming that they're 90% done from the available information is deeply ignorant.

I was talking about whathisface's obsessive desire to chase after every new gfx engine that came out...

Oh.

Yeah, that was poor leadership.

Fair points Jon, especially the third

Do you keep a copy of the agile manifesto over your bed, Jon`C?

No, and nothing I've said in this thread indicates whether or not I like agile.

i went from posting regularly to occasionally lurking, now i hardly ever check massassi. the threads all seem to be about the latest computer related cnn article or about something else completely irrelevant to my likes or interests

massassi, to me, is already dead

What the?

CNN cares about computers new?
I thought it was all Tiger Woods' penis.

so where are you guys going when this forum finally breathes its last breath? I think I'll be joining the youtube video comment community - seems like a bunch of decent human beings with cool conversations.

Good lord, forgive me for picking some arbitrary number to explain a simple point.

And for the record, the whole time I was writing that, I was looking at zell.

Uh, no. If you're waiting until you're done to find out if it's fun, you're destined to fail. This is what prototypes are for. And, after the prototypes, it's why gameplay is the first element; it's why, to use an actual example, Braid was a completely playable game before a single piece of the final graphics was painted.

And, lets not forget, BM:S is a special case. They aren't doing anything new, just copying a game they already know is fun.

He has a point, Prototype was quite a fun game.

Massassi still gives me faster replies than a lot of current-gen gaming forums.

I guess we just grew out of the spammy phase. Still, it would be nice for more people to talk about what's happening in their lives or whatever, and for less people to ***** at them the moment they do.

Deadman just **** off with that personal bull**** already, you ******