So, recently my room-mate bought a new PC for gaming. It's a HP Pavillion, and we both use it for gaming.

The problem is the keyboard. We both have all our keys mapped around the arrow keys. We've been playing all our PC games like this for most of our lives.

The keyboard that came with the PC isn't any good for us, because it doesn't even allow you to press two arrow keys and a 3rd key, let alone a 4th. This problem is called lockout. Most people seem to refer to this as 'ghosting', but it really is lockout. Ghosting is when you press a combination of keys and instead it registers a key that you didn't press.

Over the past ten years or so we've been using an old PS2 keyboard that never died on us. It was a really cheap keyboard, only €8, but it was incredible... you could make combinations of any 5 keys at the same time around the arrow keys, without any issues whatsoever. However, PCs do not use PS2 anymore, and a converter (which is ridiculously expensive compared to a new keyboard) will not help response time.

So, looking around for a new keyboard we checked out some 'Gamer keyboards'. Most of you will probably have one of these fancy things, hyper-responsiveness, anti-ghosting, you name it.

However, it seems the majority of 'Gamer keyboards' is geared towards the WASD crowd, and only supports anti-ghosting for the left side of the keyboard.

We bought a Razer Arctosa. It claims that you can press any five keys at the same time, but alas. Only on the left side of the keyboard. We were hoping to circumvent the problem by using macros, registering keys in succession, but the latest driver didn't even work properly on our PC. Half of the options didn't do anything and we couldn't appoint any macros at all. So it's going back to the store.

Is there anyone here using the right side (arrow keys) for gaming, and if so, any recommendations for a solid keyboard?

The problem is that some keyboards advertise having non-ghosting arrow keys, but that doesn't guarantee they won't lockout. It's very hard to find information on the net about lockout issues. Just a lot of pissed-off arrow keys users, it seems.

tl;dr version: I'm looking for a keyboard for gaming that is suitable for mapping your keys around the arrow keys without lockout issues (keys not registering after more than two at the same time are pressed)

TIL that there are people who don't use WASD for computer gaming...

I'll never understand why anyone who uses the mouse in their right hand would use arrow keys for movement in a PC game.

(I know nothing about keyboards, so I can't help you out).

"You're not a real gamer if you don't play with WASD" :hurr:

I use arrow keys for strafing. Up and down for forward and back. I have tried playing with WASD but it's so inconvenient to make certain combos... much easier on the right side for me.

And yes, I do play with the mouse.

don't get one
I'm using some generic ~30 dollar thing and it works fine.
Comedy Option- dig up a model M

I still use arrow keys unless forced to use WASD. I never go very expensive with my keyboards, I'm currently using a Saitek Eclipse II but I've never done any lockout or ghosting tests. Either I've been very lucky or I simply dont do many simultaneous keypresses.

I ain't saying you're not a "real gamer" for using the arrow keys; I just don't understand why. Using the arrow keys generally means your hands are really close together, and there's generally access to less nearby other keys than with a WASD configuration.

Thing is, we don't even really want a gaming keyboard, we're just happy to find anything that doesn't lockout when pressing two arrow keys plus another key or two.

I'm making 3 and 4 key combos all the time.

What you are looking for is called n-key rollover. You will usually only find it in small run, high-end typing keyboards with mechanical switches (i.e. not gaming keyboards.)

"gaming" anything always means overpriced crap too.

Thanks Jon`C. I've seen that term before. I'll look into it.

Okay... it looks like anti-ghosting keyboards are more likely to jam or lock out keys when more than two are pressed simultaneously, because they limit the amount of keys that get registered. So it's what you DON'T want.

Looking into n-key rollover, I found out that the entire problem exists because of USB. PS2 keyboards simply don't have this problem at all.

I might go for the PS2-USB adapter after all, because my old PS2 keyboard has never let me down. It's worth a shot, and cheaper than n-key rollover keyboards. I hope it won't hurt response time too much.

I was fairly certain that it had nothing to do with USB and everything to do with cost savings when building keyboards.

It does have to do to do with saving costs on USB keyboards, but the point is that PS2 keyboards don't have this problem.

Like I said, my 8 year old €8 PS2 keyboard can handle any combination I'm throwing at it.

The Steel Series keyboards are supposedly 100% mechanical (I suppose that means analogue?) and come with both USB and PS2 connectors. It might be marketing talk though.

No.

First, USB has a hard limit of 6-key rollover plus modifier keys. This is due to the USB HID specification. A PS/2-to-USB adapter will not change this and may actually make it worse, depending on how well designed the adapter is.

Second, n-key rollover is very expensive to implement in hardware, which is the real reason it is uncommon. It has always been uncommon: the IBM Model M keyboard, for example, is only designed for 2-key rollover. Realistically your old PS/2 keyboard is probably 3- or 4-key rollover and you just got "lucky" with the key combinations it is sacrificing. The benefit of NKRO, even with USB, is that all 6-key chords will work no matter what.

HP computer? That's your first mistake. Maybe I just have uncanny unluck with HP, but my impression is that just about everything from HP is garbage. Anyone know otherwise? (I've not bought tons of products from them, but the ones I have have never worked right (printers that won't feed properly or that have little plastic parts break off after a few weeks of owning them, mouses that jump around the screen even when tracking on mouse pads, etc.)

Also, lots of left-handed gamers use the arrow keys and/or the number pad for movement. Less common for right handed people, but it's not a terrible option, and if that's what he's used to and what works for him then so be it.

Also, I have a close friend who uses the arrow keys too, so it's not like I've never heard about it, and yes, if it works for him, good for him. I've just never understood how people saw it as advantageous. It's like someone telling me they'd rather drive a car with their elbows on the steering wheel than their hands.

You're probably right. Some tech blog was claiming PS2 could handle anything, so that's my mistake for taking his word for it.

My old PS2 keyboard though, can handle five keys at the same time; I can press two arrow keys, right control, right shift, plus any key on the numpad.

That's why I was assuming it was correct. I must have been real lucky, I guess?

Also, it seems like there's no such thing as a PCI card with PS2 connectors. =\

There's nothing inherently wrong with using the arrow keys if it is what you prefer. The only problem is that mass-market keyboards are mostly all designed to permit complex key combinations around WASD, because that is what most people use. You will always have to spend a lot more time and money to find a good keyboard.

To put it another way, you are spending hundreds of dollars for the privilege of not having to move your hand 10 inches to the left. I can't judge, because I've honestly spent a fortune on keyboards in the past 15 years, but if that were the only thing I wanted out of a keyboard I would just suck it up and switch.

I have always played using the arrow keys. But a couple years ago I finally got sick and tired of having to modify my keyboard settings, so I started changing over to WSAD. Now the only game that I play with arrow keys is TF2, simply because I have so much muscle memory from playing it.

Several things;

'Mechanical' keyboards -seem- to be the way to go. There are several brands that manufacture them, and the cheapest models are around €80. Most of them come with both PS2 and USB connectors. If you connect it with PS2, you can supposedly press any number of keys simultaneously, and they will all register. If you connect it with USB the limit is 6 keys simultaneously. That is, if the reviews I'm reading are right.

We found a cheap USB keyboard that my room-mate got when the office where she was working had to clear out some computer parts. I tried it, and it does actually allow me to press two arrow keys plus right control and the Apps key. It is really slow on the response though, plus I can't bind the Right Shift key at all, for some odd reason. (I've had this issue with any keyboard we've tried on this PC, so that's probably related to our PC itself - need to look into that still.)

I just remembered that the PS2 keyboard that we used before the other one (that's still 'alive') was working just the same, and it was a different, but also very cheap brand. I could also press 5 keys at the same time on that one, before Coca-Cola killed it.

Mechanical switches feel and behave very differently than the rubber dome membrane keyboards you've used. They are designed for typing, not for gaming. Rubber dome keyboards have very weird characteristics but generally behave a lot like gamepad buttons - good for games, you can kinda 'bounce' keys off of their activation point for sensitive movements. Mechanical switches vary, but most of them offer almost linear resistance, bottom out hard, activate roughly halfway through the stroke, and have a higher release point than the activation point - you practically need to lift your finger off of the key in order to release it.

I love my daskeyboard for typing, but I'm definitely not as good at games with it.

I have a model M that I use exclusively for ****ing about in dos and writing code. Sometimes I'll write inane **** just because it feels good.

That's all you ever write.

Damn, Did I just get MLYPed?

More or less. I still love how you put forth the effort more than anyone else on here. I actually don't hate you at all... in case you haven't understood by now that I just like to make smartass replies to your posts.

Yeah, that's what I'm reading, so that's probably not the ideal solution either.

Cherry Black switches are supposed to be decent for gaming, from what I remember. Personally, I use an old IBM model F keyboard that I found in my attic -- you learn pretty quickly that you only have to hit the key partway to actuate it.