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Thread: Threads of the Never-ending Story

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Calilmalith View Post
    It does if the creation of one character, more than one character, or no characters by a single writer is the result of a difference in attitude toward, or expectation of writing for, NeS. Hence my phrasing "Perhaps here we are looking at another distinct subset ...". It is merely a hypothesis which may be investigated.
    I just have my doubts the rootcause in those cases would be from the number of hteir characters, is all. Perhaps something that could be looked into though.

    So what you are saying is: Stories satisfy readers' wants (a story) with the process of the storytelling irrelevant. Games satisfy the players' wants (meaningful action of play) with any product from the game irrelevant.

    Therefore what are you really saying when you state that NeS involves more "process" than most stories and more "product" than most games? Three possibilities spring to my mind - none of which may be correct!

    1) Doesn't NeS still only involve as much process as any game and as much product as any story which would make your statement a little like judging apples on how orange they are, and oranges on how red they are?

    2) Or are you implying that NeS is attempting to satisfy readers with the process of the storytelling and satisfy players with any product from the game - which is likely to be impossible.

    3) Or are you proposing that NeS stories satisfy players wants with the process of the storytelling (meaningful play) and the NeS "game" satisfies readers wants with the product from the game (stories).

    Sorry to pound on this one but I really don't feel your original statement is either clear enough or strong enough at present. You can, of course, ignore me!
    No apologies needed - this is good. First off, you now understand correctly. I should say however that the other parts are not irrelevant like I may have implied -- process can shape how a story is both produced and received (though various media) and product can shape how process is meaningful in gameplay and such. However, ultimately, stories focus on product and games on process. With that said:

    1) Yes, it would be, except that I try to conclude by saying that NeS is neither an apple or an orange, just something that bears resemblence to both. Well, in so far as the metaphor allows anyway.

    2) I think you mean product of story and process of games (since the same words seem to be used for question 3). Yes, I think that's impossible, or at the very least, it's not what NeS does.

    3) Yes, NeS does this to a degree, but again to #1 (and to my synthesis), NeS is not best understood as either but something else.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Tracer View Post
    I don't really use the profiles. The characters just change so much.
    Geez, I'd like to think NeS isn't THAT inconsistent, or even that dynamic. They certainly go through a lot, but I don't think it shines a light in comparison to, say, Lost or many other serials like it.

  3. #43
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    so you're basically saying NeS is a fruit, but not any specific kind of fruit...

    is there a broader category that both games and stories fall into?

  4. #44
    Well technically they both fall under categories of communication, but otherwise I don't think there's a broader category they both fall under. With fiction stories, they certainly fall under artificial, and both stories and games usually involve conflict of some sort. There's probably no good broader category I'm aware of because of the whole product/process thing. If anyone has any ideas, though, throw 'em out!

    Also, how much longer do you all think I should keep this thread stickied before I un-sticky it?

  5. #45
    I', going to unsticky it now and put a link to it on the workshop thread. Thanks for all the feedback, and please continue to respond more to this thread if you wish!
    The Plothole: a home for amateur, inclusive, collaborative stories
    http://forums.theplothole.net

  6. #46
    Interesting read. Thank you for pointing it out (even if you feel self indulgent for doing so, it was enlightening).

    You're beginning thesis was understandable, though the antithesis caught me by surprise. All in all, I can't find disagreements with your arguments so you covered enough of the angles. I hope you got your degree.

    Guess I should put my own story here is only for propriety, shouldn't I? OK then...

    I'm an amateur writer. Amateur in this case meaning perpetual brainstorm, not even my amateur writing gets off the ground. I found the NeS through observation of Gebohq at the Gaming Guardian's forum. Through him, I've known the Neverending Story existed for awhile, but I've never been confident enough in my writing or my consistency to take the plunge.

    Then... I decided to read the entirety of the NeS. As humbling as parts of it were, it certainly put into perspective what it takes to write in the Neverending story. So somewhere in the middle of NeSquared I registered an account, and after finishing the story I PMed Geb a somewhat embarrassing PM about having finished the story and considering joining the "project".

    Two weeks later I finished Ben's profile and wrote up my first post. Since then Tracer and Britt have continued being consistent posters, while JM and Al Ciao have returned from the grave. All makes me feel... rather intimidated, but the humility is probably doing me good.

    I admit I've considered stealing the format of the NeS myself, though mostly as a true child of the NeS kind of way, getting those characters not involved in Young's creation to write their own story in order to create a true child of the NeS, a child who was actually a story. Not sure if this should take place on the ISB or on another forum.

    I will admit one of the things I do most wrong is getting a little testy when I see people do something "wrong" with Ben. I'll live and learn, though. Eventually he'll be established enough that everyone, even me, will know how to handle him right.

    So, for now, I just need to hold tight and enjoy the ride.

  7. #47
    A lot of the reason the anti-thesis appears, apart from my own beliefs on the matter, is that I found it a common comparison made by those in the Gaming Guardian community. They'd say that it was just an odd type of free-form role-playing (which in itself is actually considered bordering the line by those who wrote Rules of Play). Having re-read parts of the thesis myself, I feel some things could stand to have a bit more 'proof' behind them. My professor liked it all the same as far as I could tell (he was very adamant that we put all our efforts into explaining and examining the marginal media and its community as opposed to formal documentation and the like), and yes, I did get my degree.

    I'm glad you decided to join! And I hope you'll become more confident and continue to enjoy the ride as you go.

    Quote Originally Posted by Benjamin_Mahir View Post
    I admit I've considered stealing the format of the NeS myself, though mostly as a true child of the NeS kind of way, getting those characters not involved in Young's creation to write their own story in order to create a true child of the NeS, a child who was actually a story. Not sure if this should take place on the ISB or on another forum.
    Not a bad idea, but at the risk of sounding morbid, I feel it might die as an infant. A lot of story threads, at least here, have had difficulty getting off the ground. I certainly wouldn't mind another forum (which might give it a better chance), so long as those there are aware of the NeS here as well. Such an idea could very well have the potential to propagate the NeS and its community in a good way.

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