Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Mortality sucks...

  1. #1

    Mortality sucks...

    I can't seem to stop thinking about this. Its been on my mind for the last two years. I just hate the idea of dying one day and snapping into non-existence eternally. To be eventually forgotten by everything, no trace of your existence.

    Needless to say, I am without religion. I have found far too many errors in the bible, that require huge leaps of faith, and adopting views that almost amount to conspiracy theories (Satan change the archaelogical remains to mislead us, archaelogists are Satanist and publish lies, etc.) to overcome them.

    So that rules out Christianity, Judaism and Islam. Can't say I'm interested in anything else. Life still seems to suck though. As Carl Sagan once said: "Knowledge is preferable to ignorance."
    Nothing to see here, move along.

  2. #2
    No Longer Homeless!
    Fancy Pants

    Posts
    9,833
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secular_humanism

    On a slightly related note (to mortality), my ex just found out he has stage 4 lymphoma. so that's fun.

  3. #3
    Speaking as someone for whom theological hopes of an afterlife hold no purchase whatsoever, and moreover, who finds the concept of any kind existence, this one included, itself to be not only improbable, but downright outrageous, the notion of eternal non-existence (and a fortiori, eternal non-suffering), while comforting, strikes me as altogether unnatural, for various aesthetic reasons. As for your fear of death, it is probably no more than an artifact of living as an organism whose existence was contingent on your genetic makeup having encoded a visceral revulsion to the notion of forgoing literally any opportunity at all, ever, to further propagate (which of course is only possible so long as you stay alive).

    The upshot of this? It does in fact make a ton of sense to really, really try to stay alive, and then make the most of it (so long as your life is better than that of an ISIS prisoner), because in my opinion, it is as likely as anything that, after death, "you" will "wake up" as a foot soldier in an alien ant farm, 2.7E875 big bangs from now... and it's going to suck, big time.

    But hooray for death, it won't last long! And, each time you are dragged against your will to do this thing we call experience life (though perhaps as a much stupider organism), you probably won't think anything deep and depressing about death too much until it happens (although your life will probably be filled with more immediate flavours of fear).

    If you have the luxury of typing at a computer without being chased by a predator, rejoice, and resolve to live up what you've got in your own unique way. We really do live in a remarkable time, for all that's wrong with the world. Everybody's got something to offer, though many of us spend far too long waiting for somebody to open our eyes to it.

    If you really feel a profound lack of purpose, I would suggest, if you can, working yourself into a position where you'd be are able to help others, since this kind of activity does wonders for the soul.
    Last edited by Reverend Jones; 02-14-2017 at 02:24 AM.

  4. #4
    Mortality delivers.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Vin View Post
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secular_humanism

    On a slightly related note (to mortality), my ex just found out he has stage 4 lymphoma. so that's fun.
    It sucks to hear that about anyone. If I have to die, I don't want it to be that way. May we all meet our fates peacefully or at the very least, in a way of our own choosing.


    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend Jones View Post
    Speaking as someone for whom theological hopes of an afterlife hold no purchase whatsoever, and moreover, who finds the concept of any kind existence, this one included, itself to be not only improbable, but downright outrageous, the notion of eternal non-existence (and a fortiori, eternal non-suffering), while comforting, strikes me as altogether unnatural, for various aesthetic reasons. As for your fear of death, it is probably no more than an artifact of living as an organism whose existence was contingent on your genetic makeup having encoded a visceral revulsion to the notion forgoing literally any opportunity at all, ever, to further propagate (which of course is only possible so long as you stay alive).

    The upshot of this? It does in fact make a ton of sense to really, really try to stay alive, and then make the most of it (so long as your life is better than that of an ISIS prisoner), because in my opinion, it is as likely as anything that, after death, "you" will "wake up" as a foot soldier in an alien ant farm, 2.7E875 big bangs from now... and it's going to suck, big time.

    But hooray for death, it won't last long! And, each time you are dragged against your will to do this thing we call experience life (though perhaps as a much stupider organism), you probably won't think anything deep and depressing about death too much until it happens (although your life will probably be filled with more immediate flavours of fear).

    If you have the luxury of typing at a computer without being chased by a predator, rejoice, and resolve to live up what you've got in your own unique way. We really do live in a remarkable time, for all that's wrong with the world. Everybody's got something to offer, though many of us spend far too long waiting for somebody to open our eyes to it.

    If you really feel a profound lack of purpose, I would suggest, if you can, working yourself into a position where you'd be are able to help others, since this kind of activity does wonders for the soul.
    Very inspiring and uplifting. Thanks for taking the time to write that.
    Nothing to see here, move along.

  6. #6
    Mortality Bites

    Sorry for the lousy German

  7. #7
    Which reminds me: Gold, if you wanna explore your feelings about the topic, I heard there was this cool Mexican thingy called Grim Fandango. It may just be popular `round these parts, though I myself haven't played it.

  8. #8
    ^^vv<><>BASTART
    Posts
    8,967
    It should lead you down some correct paths. Realizing you're going to die is a good motivation to take life seriously and make more important choices with your time.

  9. #9
    No Longer Homeless!
    Fancy Pants

    Posts
    9,833
    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend Jones View Post
    Which reminds me: Gold, if you wanna explore your feelings about the topic, I heard there was this cool Mexican thingy called Grim Fandango. It may just be popular `round these parts, though I myself haven't played it.
    The problem with Grim Fandango is that I got stuck and didn't finish it.

  10. #10
    I never played it. Buuuut, I heard that when LEC used to make adventure games, they would sometimes include puzzles with bizarre and arbitrary solutions without clues, so that the best strategy for finding them is exhaustive search.

  11. #11
    Human Computer
    Posts
    2,826
    As someone who thinks about death often (purposefully) but who has learned to not concern himself with how he'll be remembered, I offer the following two books that I found interesting & relevant. They're both atheist-friendly.


    ? :)

  12. #12
    Also by Christopher Hitchens: How to Die Early by Smoking.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by SF_GoldG_01 View Post
    So that rules out Christianity, Judaism and Islam. Can't say I'm interested in anything else. Life still seems to suck though. As Carl Sagan once said: "Knowledge is preferable to ignorance."
    do you have a minute to hear about the all father Odin?
    eat right, exercise, die anyway

  14. #14
    Try Discordianism my man. I've already excommunicated you but you can start your own offshoot and as pope can excommunicate me from that one. And participating in OM is at once a great way to ignore the gaping maw of the absurd and to soften the inevitability of your own death through silliness.
    Epstein didn't kill himself.

  15. #15

  16. #16
    Name:  global-resilience-guru-1444923700.jpg
Views: 143
Size:  20.0 KB

    "software engineer, disaster consultant, global resilience guru, visionary"

    Now, I haven't read the article, but with a byline like that, how am I not supposed to assume I'm not about to read about Silicon Valley's take on Alex Jones?

    Is this gonna be Jill Stein's "fact checker" a la Trump and Jones come 2021?

  17. #17
    ^^vv<><>BASTART
    Posts
    8,967
    Quote Originally Posted by SF_GoldG_01 View Post
    I can't seem to stop thinking about this. Its been on my mind for the last two years. I just hate the idea of dying one day and snapping into non-existence eternally. To be eventually forgotten by everything, no trace of your existence.

    Needless to say, I am without religion. I have found far too many errors in the bible, that require huge leaps of faith, and adopting views that almost amount to conspiracy theories (Satan change the archaelogical remains to mislead us, archaelogists are Satanist and publish lies, etc.) to overcome them.

    So that rules out Christianity, Judaism and Islam. Can't say I'm interested in anything else. Life still seems to suck though. As Carl Sagan once said: "Knowledge is preferable to ignorance."
    So I've felt like writing a more thought-out reply to this but I wasn't sure exactly how to say what I want to say. This will be long. Much of my perspective on life and death has come from readings of German existentialists (if I'm allowed to use that word).

    I don't think you're unique in feeling this way. In fact, I think you, along with many other people, are disillusioned with the supposed great qualities of modern life. Material wealth tells us nothing in regard to who we are and what we should be. And increasingly, our purposeful existences are fading. We have less and less to live for. When we live our lives without purpose, we must feel anxious about dying, because what we do is what we do until death, and to do nothing purposeful until death is a terrible thought. It's a sort of societal nihilism, not that edgy bull****, but a more real nihilism towards life, and it's hard to avoid.

    But to agree with your stance against Christianity, as well, against "scientism"; well, they do provide meaning. I don't like either though; they're unsatisfactory views to me. Christianity, as Nietzsche said, is a metaphysics of the hangman. Christianity requires of us to be perfect. But we aren't. So, either we have to be inauthentic and pretend, or be forever eternally guilty. I reject either, so I must reject Christianity. I also disapprove of it's assertion of the existence of timeless souls. Beware of anything anyone tells you exists forever. Nothing is forever in the actual world. For scientism, well, the ethics of scientism are utilitarian (read: happiness maximizing) ethics. Maximizing happiness is fine as a secondary motive, but I think people need to think about such a world. Imagine we could achieve the ideal: no wars, no sickness, a completely perfect society with no strife. What would life then amount to? Would that not be boring? I think maximizing happiness is best, after we have discovered our projects. I really think many people envision heaven as a bunch of people lazing around on grassy hills, listening to harps. It sounds awful. There's also the alternative of taking antidepressants. Now I'm possibly going to upset people by being anti-pharmaceutical, but I somewhat am. Currently 13% of Americans are on antidepressants. That is a huge amount of people combating psychological ailments with methods that nobody else ever in history had. I mean, is having anxiety about who you are and what you're here for really that bad? Why is this even happening, societally? Note, there are quite a few people for whom antidepressants are a necessary medication, but, I think they're overprescribed, possibly a majority of people who take it don't need it. But there's also some pretty solid research which suggests antidepressants are no more effective than placebo pills for most people. Eh? Marx was wrong, religion isn't the opium of the masses, drugs are.

    I'll give some formulations for how one can find an authentic purpose in life before they die. Nietzsche imagines a way out of this by challenging us: imagine if you were forced to relive your life, forever again, exactly the same. What would you do? How much of your life do you want to relive? Do you think your choices would be different? I mean, don't just think for two seconds, really go out in a meditative place, contemplate your life and see where you've been, who you are. You may find a pressing desire to do something new, better, or even to love your past and want it to continue. I find that I'd want to live a life more dangerous, daring, and explorative when I think of life this way. How dull would it be to sit through all of those hours of World of Warcraft again. But what I would give to relive my travels. You get the point. There's also Heidegger. To Heidegger, we are really only being truthful about our actual, worldly existence when we are aware of it's temporality by being there, actually in the world. Meaning, all of this stuff that we do, sitting back and thinking about ourselves–is just one way of thinking, of being, of existing. We forget when doing this that, when we're actually in the world doing stuff, we don't sit back and contemplate–they're very different activities and sloppy thinking on the part of philosophers of old fails to note this obvious but important distinction. But as well, we become authentic by owning ourselves and owning up to ourselves. This means to no longer be a victim of circumstance, and to make choices that decide your own future in your own way, and taking responsibility for yourself and what you will be toward death. Find something that's authentic to you.

    I hope you read and appreciate what I'm saying to you. These views have been important for me and worked for me.

  18. #18
    Human Computer
    Posts
    2,826
    This thread reminded me of another little book that I wanted to read, so I did so yesterday, & would like to add it to my recommendations.

    ? :)

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend Jones View Post
    Name:  global-resilience-guru-1444923700.jpg
Views: 143
Size:  20.0 KB

    "software engineer, disaster consultant, global resilience guru, visionary"

    Now, I haven't read the article, but with a byline like that, how am I not supposed to assume I'm not about to read about Silicon Valley's take on Alex Jones?

    Is this gonna be Jill Stein's "fact checker" a la Trump and Jones come 2021?
    much worse, he is part of the Burningman death cult
    Epstein didn't kill himself.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •