I heard something interesting the other day. The guy talking basically said that Bush wanted more oil for the oil-grubbing Americans. The other guy pointed out that it was very interesting how Democrats voted for going to war with Iraq in order for us to get oil, but that they wouldn't approve drilling for oil in Alaska because a few hundred animals may be killed.

So, go vote for Kerry. A few hundred animals are worth more to the world than a few thousand innocent Iraqis and over 500 American soldiers.

Oh, and I also find it interesting that everyone is blaming Bush himself, as opposed to the House and the Senate that overwhelmingly voted to support the war (and in fact, give permission for Bush to go in there).

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EvilMagic.net: Brian's Web Log

Funny how it works out that way, especially in an election year. Oh yeah, Kerry voted in favor of this little war in Iraq.

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I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

Twice.

Anyway, I'm pissed off about the "War for Oil" argument because either the jack offs using that arguement need to shut up, or Bush is keeping it from me because prices have been going up.

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If you ever want to be hated by your peers, make them look bad. That's what America did.

Hahahahahaha! He voted yes for Iraq but no for Afghan? That guy has jacked up priorities.

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If you ever want to be hated by your peers, make them look bad. That's what America did.

Kerry is all over the place with his political stances. That's something that Bush and co. should be hammering as the election comes up. A president should have a clear, consistent stance otherwise you'd never know what you're going to get when you vote him in.

Yes but if you drill the oil in Iraq, those thousands of iraquis won't be killed as a consequence of the drilling, but rather as a consequence of the war. So taking that into concideration, both candidates are just as bad.

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When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

Eh. I don't really get the environmentalist argument. I mean, I love nature and everything - I was a scout - but when you think about it, people are animals too. Eventually it'll get to the point where we'll have to build apartment complexes up there just to survive, so all it's doing is speeding up the inevitable.

I think the alaska thing was more the enviroment than the animals..

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MadQuack on Military school: Pro's: I get to shoot a gun. Con's: Everything else.
"I'm going to beat you until the laws of physics are violated!!" ! Maeve's Warcry

RIP -MaDaVentor-. You will be missed.

Ahahahaha, before Bush was elected he said it was wrong for the States to use the army as a "nation builder." Glad to see he stuck by his principles.


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BV's rendition of Titanic: Let's have sex. I won't let go. I don't need this stone.
The End.
~ Wolfy

...wouldn't we die from lack of resources when our population grew to the size that required us to actually live in alaska?



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Roach - I believe in God, only I spell it Nature.--Frank Lloyd Wright

0 of 14.

Well, following that logic, we're all gonna die of old age eventually.. so why not just grab a knife and kill ourselves right now? It's just speeding up the inevitable.


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When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

It's just a little hypocritical to set up a wildlif preserve then come in a few years later and start drilling for oil, which doesn't have a great public record for being environmentally friendly. Also, drilling for more oil will only perpetuate the the problem of oil being a limited resource.

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I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

[This message has been edited by Avenger (edited March 16, 2004).]

Brian, your post didn't make any sense. I think it fell apart when you said "Democrats voted for going to war with Iraq in order to get oil".

In any case, the majority of House Democrats voted against authorizing the war in Iraq and the Senate vote was a close 29/21 for/against. Also, the language of the joint bill is clear that the "continuing threat" that Iraq was supposed to have posed to the US was the critical reason for allowing the use of military force. Every one of our representatives was acting on falsehoods that were presented as truths.

[This message has been edited by Ictus (edited March 16, 2004).]

Yeah, exactly! And he'll probably use 9/11 as his excuse for that, too. Like using the excuse that those countries harbored people that would commit acts like that is an excuse for forcing our western philosophies on them. Plus there's all the evidence showing that Bush had advance knowledge. All very suspicious if you ask me.

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former TACC outcast

While Bush is no saint, I wouldn't trust Kerry farther than I could throw him. As someone else pointed out, his views are all over the place, and his decisions sometimes seem to contradict previous ones. At least Bush sticks with a decision and keeps the same stance, bad decision or otherwise.



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Kids must be shot by Monday.

Honesty tests for workers can't be trusted, report says.

Psychopaths are unpredictable.

Jay Leno's Headlines > Everything

With all of the articles we read on these boards about idiot humans, I think the world would be better off with just the wildlife.

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"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

"Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right." -Isaac Asimov

Bush is a crappy president too. That doesn't mean we should vote for someone else with a record of hypocrisy.

Edit: To clarify intent of original post: I never said Bush was perfect or that I even think Bush is a good president. If I was him, that's what I would attack Kerry on.

[This message has been edited by Jedi Legend (edited March 16, 2004).]

bobafett: Not even. Bush has reversed or reneged upon dozens of promises and positions, including gay marriage, affirmative action, abortion (!), and funding the Low Income Home Energy Assistance program, among others. Media typecasting is for people who don't have the capacity for reality.

[This message has been edited by Ictus (edited March 16, 2004).]

I wish I could find a candidate who I could vote for because I liked him, not because he's the lesser of two evils

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"Our hero chucks a few rocks..."

Dream on. Never gonna happen.

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When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

......hehehe......*snicker*........why do I get the feeling you don't actually know that? hehehe.......

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If you ever want to be hated by your peers, make them look bad. That's what America did.

Come back Perot!

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If you ever want to be hated by your peers, make them look bad. That's what America did.

I would've voted for Clark...

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<Kroko> Massassi is like Nazi Germany online, only it's not in Germany.

Kieran: Of course I know it. I looked it up when I wrote the post.

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Who's a worthless, anonymous automaton that's losing consciousness?
Who wanted this? Who's on this trip to see the sights and monuments?
To read and write the documents by light that seems innocuous
'Til you discern it's pages burning that provides the phosphorescence?
Jesse Dangerously - Words Ending in -ic for $1000

That doesn't change the fact that Kerry voted for military action in Iraq and is now denouncing it.

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I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

Avenger: The Iraq war was sold to Congress exclusively on WMDs and terrorist links. Kerry made his decision based on information that was false. And was lacking the numerous warnings that Bush recieved from practically every intelligence agency in the US government. I would guess that's why he now opposes the war.

Ictus, the place where you read that must really have its facts wrong. The Senate has 100 members....2 from each state, not 50.

Anyways, to quote someone "I think I'll wake up, and go to fill up my car with some nice Iraqui oil....oh wait, there is none"

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Only To Keep The Public Happy

mscbuck: There were 50 Democrats in the Senate at the time. The subject was the number of Democrats who voted for the war. Sorry for the confusion.

[This message has been edited by Ictus (edited March 16, 2004).]

... and this is why I never registered to vote. I hate politcal "flaming." I refuse to call it arguing cause honestly, I highly doubt any information anybody gets on this is factual. Secondly, I'm in a state where nothing really bothers me and I'm the most apathetic person in the world atm. And secondly, I don't want jury duty.

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Prowling out of the tundra, swinging a jeweled meat hammer, cometh Outlaw Torn! And he gives a gutteral bellow:

"I'm seriously going to hump you until you scream like a banshee!"

No, animals don't intentionally destroy other animals' habitats so they can leach natural resources at a far greater rate than they can be replenished and use those reasources to destroy the earth's atmosphere.

I feel that the Iraqis owe us some oil-- at least enough to make up for what was used during the war. (we used our oil, not theirs, or so i was told)



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I had a good idea for a perfect new sig, but then I forgot what it was...

They would if they could.

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Roach - I believe in God, only I spell it Nature.--Frank Lloyd Wright

0 of 14.

lifeaftertheoilcrash

Harry Braun for President
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Our very existence is at stake

[This message has been edited by Ric_Olie (edited March 16, 2004).]

I found interesting a political ad put out by Bush pointing out that Kerry voted for us to go to Iraq... But then when the time came to vote to back our troops he opted out.... Can anyone say "Hung out to dry"? I would really like his motives for that one a bit more clearly displayed... Less pay for soldiers? Naw. Less benefits for their families? Naw. Body armor? Naw... I mean what exactly would the reasoning be behind something like that? We don't need to spend the money cause they're in no danger? Hey, if we don't help support them more will die and they can get home quicker? I mean come on. Give me a break.

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"So there I was completely naked and covered in tartar sauce..."

There are/were a few options that weren't "Republicrats". Nader is running, and I think Pat Buchannan might be going for another try. Both the Republican and Democratic Parties have grown too mudied, trying to win over the middle voter. America lacks both a true Liberal party, and a true Conservative party.

As for Ross Perot, he quit after seeing how much worse his results were in the '96 election. In '92, he got nearly 20%, more than any third-party candidate has ever gotten. Because the conservative voters realized that he turned what was already a minority of right-wing voters into even smaller pieces, they realized they'd have better chances just voting for the Republican. It was kinda like how Nader affected the 2000 election.

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Nes digs around in the trash can.
Nes finds a hamburger!
Nes puts the hamburger in his backpack.

I've read the former site before. As a Political Science student, I know that that is a very important (and highly studied) issue. As for how the invasion of Iraq fits into this, I like how one of my professors put it best:

Also, according to roughly 100% of all serious political research, the United States is beginning to fall from its place as a superpower, and will be superceeded by another nation (probably China). Most of the calculated predictions say that this will happen between 2020-2030. The USA's military power won't matter - after all, China's pumping ever more money into upgrading theirs, and their technology is rapidly approaching ours.

However, there are a few things that can be done to prevent this. Perhaps one of the easiest ways is to possess a monopoly on energy. Already, the US develops most of the world's alternative energy technology, and is closely allied with Saudia Arabia, the world's #1 oil producer (where some 40% of our oil comes from). If the U.S. were to corner the global market for oil, the the U.S. would be an undefeatable global power, not jsut a superpower.

So, in other words, I don't think that democracy, or terrorism was behind the invasion of Iraq at all. Oil was, but not simply so that Bush and his buddies could profit (Bush is close friends with the Saudi royal family, and Dick Cheney owns huge ammounts of Haliburton Oil). owning the world's oil supply will ensure that the United States will survive the oil crash, and likely with very little damage.

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Nes digs around in the trash can.
Nes finds a hamburger!
Nes puts the hamburger in his backpack.

It's apathy like yours that makes me sick. Do you realize that political apathy is one of the few things that's truly un-American? It's sad that in the 2000 election, only about 50% of the potential voters actually turned out. So no matter who might have won that election, they would be leading the country with only ~24% of the vote behind them, a rule very unlike democracy.

I don't care who you really vote for, just try to find a person who you like more than dislike (this will exclude Bush & Kerry for the majority of us), and vote for them! Hell, if everybody would just vote, and vote for who they liked, we'd be free from being "forced" to choose between the lesser of two evils.

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Nes digs around in the trash can.
Nes finds a hamburger!
Nes puts the hamburger in his backpack.

If that's true, then how is it any better?

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When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

I didn't express any opinion in that post; I wasn't saying that it was any better. I was simply putting forth the dominant political theory. I was leaving it up to others to make use of what comes as close as truth in politics to base their opinions on.

Personally, while I do agree that it's important to make sure the US doesn't die, and even to preserve it's place as the most pwoerful country, I don't think the invasion of Iraq was the right way to go about it. Good core cause (save the US power), bad execution (Invasion of Iraq), even worse method to achieve the execution (Distorting/misinterpretting intelligence to convince Congress).

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Nes digs around in the trash can.
Nes finds a hamburger!
Nes puts the hamburger in his backpack.

But how is securing america's economical superiority a just cause? Does it justify all those people dying? I mean, following that logic, it would be a just cause for any country to attack another to gain more land and ressources - in which case you're not fighting for freedom, you're fighting for dominance.

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When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.