the characters I use most in SSBM are Ganondorf and Jigglypuff. Ganondorf for when I'm taking the game seriously (I like brute strength. It's straight to the point), and Jigglypuff for when I'm just having fun (she annoys everyone, so it's a lot of fun to win).

I'm hoping I'll get the new Mario Tennis for christmas. The original was great. I didn't like tennis at all before playing it.

They also need to stop posting that picture all together.

Yeah I'm gonna get Mario Power tennis next them maybe Mario Double Dash... this weekend I got Mario Golf and The Sims 2 so that will keep me going and occupied for a bit.

I think I will stick with FPSs.

I left little kids' games (aka anything NINTENDO) well . . . a long long time ago.

Don't those two statements contradict in a way? Perfect Dark happened to be only availible for the N64, (and is still widely held to be the best FPS ever, easily beating Halo1/2 and Half-Life1/2) and the 007 games (with the sole exception of Rogue Agent, which really isn't a 007 game in the truest sense) are also effectively Nintendo-only. I bristle at the thought that any specific console maker is only "kids' games."

Mario was in Baseball for the Game Boy way back in the day.

Wow. You're cool. Seriously. I mean I wish I could be as mature and cool as you.

Pikachu is easily the most powerful character in SSBM. In the original SSB, the most powerful character was by far Kirby. So much so that they nerfed Kirby in SSBM and he really really sucks in SSBM. But now Pikachu kicks total ***. He is an unstoppable war machine.

As a developer, they are definitly geared towards kids.

And while Perfect Dark is cool, you really can't compare it to the top PC FPS games.

Of course you can't; it beats them hands-down. EVERY game has a deathmatch mode, but what else has the Counter-Operative mode of Perfect Dark? It's like Counter-Strike, only better, as the "bad" side can trake control of any enemy they please, and order all the others arround.

One original feature does not a great game make.

/Yoda

*sigh*

Are there any FPS games that introduce more than one original gameplay style? I have yet to see one.

Anyway, the game has plenty of other (varyingly so) original ideas in it, from three full training courses: a firing range with over 100 challenges, a holographic simulation room, and a device training center; together, they add arround 5-8 hours to the gameplay, depending on how well you do at the firing range. Additionally, I think it may have been the first console FPS to have dual firing modes for each weapon. (though you have to switch between each one, instead of simply having a "fire2") Then there're other nice things in it as well, such as the fact that every line has a voice-over in the game, and there's an hour or so of cutscenes, with ones at both the beginning and end of every level, and sometimes ones in the middle.

Perfect Dark is nice, but my beef with it is that the N64 hardware can't handle it. The framerates are horrible. There is *no* excuse for poor framerates with a console game, but there it is. A perfect shining example of a console game with very poor framerates.

Counter-Strike but better?

America's Army

Did you have the RAM upgrade in your N64? I did, and I don't remember there being any problems.

It's true that the framerates on the N64 can get poor. Unfortunately, when I tried emulating it, there are many visual bugs, such as the skybox always appearing to be black. However, the framerate problems were almost entirely fixed, and would probably be completely fixed if I had a video card with more texturing pipelines...

Obviously some people here haven't played the N64 exclusive Conker's Bad Fur Day. Definitely not for kids.

The games aren't geared toward kids. They're geared towards everyone. If you can't have fun playing these games because they're too "kiddy", then you're the one with the problem.

<3 Conker. Drunk animals kick ***.

Um no.

Star Fox adventures and The Sims 2 are kinda girly but hey it's worth a shot to avoid some bordum.

No, Jigglypuff's sleep does way more than 25%, and has a high chance of knocking nearly every character off the screen. Unfortunately very few know how to use the move properly, and even fewer can use it on a regular basis. (It has ultrasmall range, and leaves you wide open if you miss.)

And anyone who says SSB:M is perfectly balanced has yet to play any of the great SSB:M players. Any of them will tell you there are levels of good players.

You will NEVER, EVER see a good player under Mr. Game and Watch defeat Marth. I'm sorry, it won't happen. If you lose, then you aren't a good player, simple as that.

Roy is actually sort of weak. He's slower, and his counter has a smaller window. Of course this is backed up by higher damage, but the slowness, in addition to a much worse spiking move and faster falling rate means that he is vastly inferior to Marth.

Pikachu lost its ranking from SSB to SSB:M. It's now a lot weaker compared to the other newer characters. Still an effective opponent however.

Jigglypuff is a highly disputed character. There is no doubt it is a highly regarded one, but whether it ranks at the Level 1 character rank has yet to be fully decided. Either way, when someone plays Jiggly and knows what he/she is doing, watch out.

Shiek is immensly popular also. (Something I am a part of :D) She is the fastest character in the game, and she can rack up combos like no other. She also has decent recovery and falling rate, making her an excellent choice, and thus ranked in the Level 1.

Marth is also immensly popular, ranked in Level 1. He is very fast, decently strong, and has crazy reach on his sword. (The tip of his sword does the most damage, unlike Roy, where the center of the blade does the most damage.) He also has a nice fall rate, and a recovery move that can get you back from nearly any situation. (Repetitively hit b -> in the direction of the map floor. Just make sure you don't continue the combo, that'll kill you. Just do the first swing over and over.) This is my best character, although I like playing as Shiek more.

Bowser is not that bad of a character, ranked at level 4. Although his size is a big problem, his attacks are crazy good, and he has a decent set of combos. His decent horizontal recovery allows him to stay alive when he does get knocked off.

Well, I think that's enough for now.

Too bad Falco pwns shiek, bowser, and marth.

I still think Fox is the most underestimated character in both games. The directional flame attack thingie is awesome. And the laser gun is great for those times when your enemy is trying to close with you to soften em up a little bit.

I'm not so sure about the Marth on that list, though...

(woohoo! 200,000th post on General Discussion!)

Fireballs, dweeb. Havent you ever played any Mario game?

Or hammers.

Actually, he is level 2. Sorry :p His attacks are much weaker, and his gun sucks compared to Fox's.

Here's the tier listing for the characters:

Lvl 1
Shiek
Fox
Marth

Lvl 2
Falco
Peach
Captain Falcon
Samus
Jigglypuff

Lvl 3
Ganondorf
Mario
Dr. Mario
Luigi
Kirby

Lvl 4
Link
Pikachu
Ice Climbers
Roy
Bowser
Young Link
Yoshi

Lvl 5
Ness
Donkey Kong
Mewtwo
Zelda

Lvl 6
Pichu
Game and Watch

So blah blah you lose

Anyway, Freelancer, he isn't underestimated, as you can see by this list Everyone knows he is right up there.

And for those wondering about the validity of this, its all from smashboards.com, which is pretty much THE source on SSB:M. They know tons, and everything is discussed and determined through lots of experimentation and calculation

Whoever can't beat shiek with Falco loses. At life.

But you wouldn't be shooting them... you'ed be throwing them and breathing air on a fire flower.

I could wave dash behind your Falco while he is firing and work him into a combo for 50% damage every single time. Not to mention she can take complete advantage of Falco's lowsy down A and lack of meteor smash.

Uh, hello, Falco's specials are meh, but his hand to hand is impeccable.

If only there was online play...

Gamecube... online... does that even exist?

...

No.

Cool Matty, I'd like to know how the **** you came up with that list. While some of it appears to be accurate, others are laughable. I've tried pure AI matches to test, and it seems that Ganondorf is easily the most powerful character. Marth and Roy are also up there. And Pichu does not belong at the bottom of the list; he'd be arround the middle, and Pickachu perhaps a single level from the top. Also, Bowser is to pathetically slow to be considered anything than rock bottom.


Actually the GameCube does have online capabilities. However, it seems that the only game that uses this functionality is Phantasy Star Online... Besides, Super Smash Bros. Melee wouldn't be anywhere near as fun in online play as it is playing in person.

"And for those wondering about the validity of this, its all from smashboards.com, which is pretty much THE source on SSB:M. They know tons, and everything is discussed and determined through lots of experimentation and calculation"

Oh, and as for online: Warp Pipe might not be much, but it's something.

They don't measure AI, because the CPU's aren't exactly a challenge. All the CPU's are stupid. If we were ranking characters based on CPU AI, then everyone would be Ranked in level 6 :p

They rank this based on the individual statistics of every single character. The number of frames it takes for each attack, the strength of each attack, the recovery speed, their comboing ability, all this gets weighted in. Yes, smashboards.com has nearly every single attack listed by how many frames it takes. I'm not kidding, they take this stuff VERY seriously.

Heck, they even measured how long the character's shields last. Did you know that Yoshi's shield lasts a frame longer than all the other characters? Now you do.

How come friendly discussions always turn into this... *insert complicated stuff*

Because we\re all nerds with high interest in computers, video games, statistics, and other complicated things.

Couldn't have said it better if I said it myself.

You also need to stop posting all together. :p

You need to stop coming into threads at their end going "LOL YOU GUYS SUCK". It's seriously getting annoying. If you're going to post something, post something of value.

CM--at the end of the day, it's still just the user who determines the greatness of a character.

i like kirby when playing super smash brothers. but that would be me, and problly ony me. oh well.