http://www.religioustolerance.org/end_wrl4.htm

I'm not worried about Malachy at all.

To be honest, the reason why I havn't posted again was because I forgot about it.

I don't think that this new pope is a nazi. I don't think tomarrow he's going to be pushing some sort of Nazi agenda. However, I am just suprised that the catholic church, which has been accused of not helping the jews during the holocaust (and even supporting Hitler), would go ahead and pick someone to be pope who was once a supporter of Hitler and the Nazis, even only if its only because he had to. There were at least 100 people who I'm sure are equally qualified to be pope, and they chose this person. To me, it says more about the Catholic Church than Ratzinger.

That's a really cute accusation, by the way.

In response to the past 40-or-so posts...

He was part of the German Army who ran away, from what I have learned from CNN. While the German Army/Nazi Army maybe be different things during World War II, you cannot deny that the German Army was fighting for Nazi Germany.

If you willingly joined the German Army under Nazi rule, yeah, I would be suspect of your character. However, if you were conscripted into the German Army, I would be less inclined to think that you supported the Nazi agenda. Rather, you had a gun pointed at your head by the Gestappo saying "Sie werden die Armee jetzt verbinden."

So are yours of the Pope.

Go back and read my post. People were FORCED into the army.

1. He was forced into the army.

2. He deserted the army.

Enough said.

Yeah, it says the Catholic Church believes people can change for the better, and should be judged on the basis who they are now rather than their former affiliations. Crazy, eh, the church acting in accordance with the fundamental principles of their religion?

As for the Pope being a billionaire -- I haven't checked into this, but if I remember the news articles from JPII's death, doesn't the Pope technically have no worldly possessions whatsoever? I mean, yes, the Roman Catholic Church itself is quite rich, but the Pope just lives in Church apartments and eats Church food and even wears the garments of the Church. He doesn't actually own anything, if I recall correctly.

The Pope is basically like the CEO of the Catholic Church, only with no salary or benefits.

Anyone else know more about this?

Meant to point this out in my last post:





I guess you didn't even consider it that big of a deal! :p

I think its a big deal

I'm not denying that. In fact, I stated that above. I also stated above that there are many things being said about the catholic chruch about its involvement -- or lack thereof -- in the holocaust. Ratzinger may not even be that bad a guy; I don't have any reason to judge the man himself. Instead, I judge the church.



Yeah, you're right. No benefits... like when he was sick all of those times before his death and got all that free healthcare... And all of that free food surely couldn't have been be a benefit... And I bet when he flew to all of those countries that came out of his wallet... i'm sure...

The pope is the head of one of the most wealthy organizations on the face of the planet, and it has been for the past 1500+ years. "Enough said."

So, if you were a billionaire would you want me to judge you to be a *****y, ****less prick? (this isn't a flame)

Guess what, i'm broke and I get free healthcare.

And of course all of that money goes directly into the Pope's pockets, eh? The church may have a lot of money, but that doesn't mean the people who run it do.

Sure, the Pope gets food and health care, but it's not like it's his to do with as he pleases. It's like a CEO who doesn't collect a salary, but his company pays for his meals and he sleeps in the corporate headquarters.

I mean, it's not like all those trips were vacations on the beach. They were business trips. The man's got all of Catholic Christendom to look after, after all.

Just a question: what do you think the Church does with all that money, other than building fancy cathedrals and feeding the Pope?

Again, I'm not judging the pope. I'm judging the institution which assigned him his power.



"Political investments."

And here I thought you were merely asking questions.

You've made up your mind so what's your point?

An inciting religious discussion at Massassi? How creative.

Such as...?

[edit: never mind about that wrong pope :)]

second of all. Who says that he doesn't give money to the poor?he may have lots of money, but that doesn't mean he doesn't give any. the pope is supposed to be the leader of Catholicism, not the poor. and before you go thinking Jean Paul is this corrupt hypocrite (I know I'm probably putting words in your mouth, but before you go criticizing him for having lots of money) just think of everything he accomplished on behalf of the poor, for the catholic faith, and even in world affairs. everyone's mourning because he really was an amazing pope.

not to say that I'm a big fan on the new pope, I personally think they shouldn't have elected someone so traditional. but still.

[edit: I'm just re-reading. yeah, he got free healthcare. what do you expect people to just let their religious leader die? and as pointed out, he wasn't going on vacations, he was traveling on business. and think of what he's accomplished on those trips. the catholic church used to be corrupt and money grubbing. but this isn't the middle ages anymore.]

The Pope doesn't own anything. He lives in an apartment with little furnishing, and everything at his disposal is owned by the Church.

That story is historical revisionism through and through. People with biases just want to forget the facts. Just ask Israel, which built a park in Pope Pius' honor with the same number of trees as the people that they estimate his actions saved. Pius should be a Saint, and would be if it weren't for a bunch of liars and people whose opinions aren't supported by facts.
He wrote letters condemning Nazi ideology and personally negotiated for the lives of thousands, but couldn't openly condemn the Nazis for fear of reprisal against Jews and Catholics. If you think that's bogus, just read the Diary of Anne Frank. That was all caused by religious leaders, including Catholic Bishops, who thought condemning the Nazis was a good idea. The Nazis arrested them and sent thousands of Jews off to death camps.

Ratzinger's Father always condemned the nazis, and the Pope has written extensively about his own opposition to the Nazis, and the Nazi rejection of Christianity as jewish propoganda. I've read a few of his writings on matters of faith, and I think that he'll be a spectacular Pope.

Can't a man CHANGE?! Paul the Apostle was himself a great persecutor of Christianity and far more active in his pursuit than Ratzinger could ever possibly be accused, and yet he is one of the most important fathers of the Church.

I kind of think those comments were a little immature, maybe I am biased being Catholic or something but Pope John Paul had a tough life... no joke, he came from the projects of Poland and had no education besdies what he taught himself and learned the value of 'hard' work at an extremely young age. He was the poor and trodden and so what if he happens to be the most righteous individual are world has ever seen, should we spat on him more and make him live a shack? I mean honestly the vatican has been around for years, everything the vatican has in terms of transportation and modern technologies was given to them. They don't go around buying the pope this and that... hardly

I am sorry i just took offense to that comment

As far as the pope being a hitler youth... imagine this

your 12, everyone has to stand in line, wear some army **** and raise there hand. It wasn't like they had him shoveling jews into ovens. And btw if you didn't stand in line and raise your hand, the consequences were pretty dire, and since he was already a christian in the first place it wasn't like they trying to convert him or anything.

O and lastly Germany and Hitlers Totaltalrianism (sp?) uprising was generally viewed as a good thing in the eyes of MANY americans before Hitler went absolutly insane. So Nazi's were in fact not the worst thing ever when they rose to power, after all the war crimes and travesties did we develop a burning hatred for Nazi's... And even after the war we (the U.S.) used remaining Nazi Officers as a spy network throughout Germany to spy on Russia. We hired a ranking General Nazi to control the whole operation and thats another story... We also welcomed Nazi scientists that commited war-crimes in to the U.S. to aid our own cause.