No. Name some of these incredible corporate tax loopholes or rescind.

The top 5% of income earners gross around 30% of the nation's income, but pay over half of the total federal tax burden. Reconcile this fact with your bull**** claim that The Rich™ pay little in taxes.

Okay, for one, a corporation can pay expenses before it pays taxes. Mere employees cannot do this.

another tax benefit that the rich use (but not related to corporation) is a section 1031 exchange, which allows a seller
to delay paying taxes on a piece of real estate; that is sold for a capital gain
through an exchange for a more expensive piece of real estate. Real estate is
one investment vehicle that allows such a great tax advantage. As long as you
keep trading up in value, you will not be taxed on the gains, until you
liquidate.

Yes, they can. A corporation can deduct reasonable and necessary business expenses. A sole proprieter can deduct business expenses. Even a "mere employee" can deduct non-reimbursed business expenses.

This isn't a "tax loophole", it's a very well-known, common-sense provision in the tax code applicable to anyone who incurs expenses related to business, including "mere employees". Perhaps you could try reading the tax code before wasting my time with this nonsense.



Section 1031 exchanges have absolutely zero impact on a person's tax burden. They allow for faster wealth accumulation, but certainly do not lower your taxes.

In other words, you get to defer taxes because you're also deferring the realization of your economic gain. When your gain is realized, you pay the government exactly the same amount as if you hadn't used a Section 1031 exchange.

Again, name some of these incredible corporate tax loopholes that allow The Rich to "pay little in forms of tax".

I'm getting screwed by my place of business. Not only did they decide not to let me back on the payroll after I came back from college for the summer (I was one of the best employees, my manajor put me in for the place's centenial award for best employees and I got it), but they still owe me a $150+ paycheck that payroll never gets around to reissuing, when I asked them to do it just before Thanksgiving.

have you ever read the entire tax code?

Before you tell me not to waste your time, just who is it that is forcing you to post in this thread, or even reply to what I have written?

It's amazing how quickly you manage to show up after I post in a financial thread.

yah, i'll get some of it back, but i woud rather live off of it now. and for the record, i do clame most of my tips, wit the exception of the change rolling around in my pocket at the end of the night.

/ i make on average 6.00-8.50 an hour on any given night.

Familiarity with the subject matter--or even just a good faith effort to research it--should be a prerequisite to engaging in an argument. A 10-second Google search for "business tax deductions" could have easily disproven your claim that "a corporation can pay expenses before it pays taxes. Mere employees cannot do this", and saved me the time of yet again having to correct your incomprehension of basic financial concepts.

Now please stop avoiding the subject. Name some of these incredible corporate tax loopholes that allow The Rich to "pay little in forms of tax".

I'm going by what Kiyosaki says about corporations.

Okay, so welcome to the real world kid. Don't take that condescendingly. Maybe you've taken the first real step toward conservatism. If you don't like the "pidly" ammount in taxes you pay how do you think the "rich" like the ammounts they pay to subsidize the lower wage earners?

I'm fortunate, being in the military, that not all of my pay is taxed. Out of last month's gross of $3920 I earned a taxable ammount of $2860. My taxes for the month were a little over $500. When I go back to Iraq in a few months my taxable income will be $0 per month. Of course I'll probably miss the birth of my child and have a better chance of being reduced to my prime elements but what the heck?

What a compelling argument: "I'm incapable of substantiating anything I've said, but only because I really don't know anything and am just regurgitating what someone else told me!"

Or, in this case, misunderstanding what someone else told you and drawing your own flawed conclusions. I seriously doubt that Kiyosaki is stupid enough to suggest that "the rich pay little in forms of tax and the middle class ends up carrying the poor".

Now name some of these incredible corporate tax loopholes that allow The Rich to "pay little in forms of tax", or rescind your claim.

you made that choice when you joined the military. what did you think a military was for anyway?

/dislikes your sarcastic attitude tward me/

I can't speak for Elana, but I'll say this: I may not like having 1/6 of my paycheck taken for taxes, but I realize that it is necessary for many of the civil services that I and others utilize.

Put up, or shut up, Page.

I figured you would dislike sarcasm but get over it. And unless your comment was based on sarcasm then you must not have paid attention to any of my posts over the past many years. I know very well what military service is all about.

I certainly agree that our government needs money. I also see Brian's points. All one has to do is spend a few minutes in a government service job to see the rampant waste, fraud, and abuse. The federal budget could easily be half what it is.

it was sarcstic

I'm 15 and i get $11 an hour for swim coaching and lifeguarding. This year so far i have gotten around $50 taken out of $450

On my $180/every two weeks paycheck, I get roughly a dollar taken off for EI, and that's it.

I feel the need to mention that you should double whatever number you see taken from Social Security.

The number they print on your check is a blatant lie, as I'm sure Brian, being self-employed, is well aware. The employer has to match your payment. It's basically blatant lying on behalf of the government.

So if you have 30 subtracted, they're really taking 60. And keep in mind if you're paying into Social Security now, you're dumping money into a black hole. You will receive nothing.

When the first Social Security checks were rolled out, no one had paid anything in but were getting things out. Therefore, in the end, many must pay in and get nothing out.

I hope to God that Bush gets Social Security reform passed. I honestly don't care if the government has to cut programs to cover for SS, as long as I don't have to dump more money into the money hemorrhage.

Indeed, I'm an Accounting major and have taken tax accounting and thus have had to read and reseach part of the Internal Revenue Code.

Page - you really need to open your eyes more to the real world and how it works then a book. Books have been published *even recently* with people arguing how the world is flat. Do you want me to start quoting those like the bible?

When you find all these numerous loopholes, quote the IRC section its found in and I'll look it up for ya! The reason the IRC is so complex is because they keep having to resolve loopholes that people are exploiting.

Your argument "This is why the rich pay little in forms of tax and the middle class ends up carrying the poor. I love it." shows you know NOTHING of how the tax brackets fall and where the most money comes from.

Maybe you should read this book



Click!

You copied and pasted that from a website didn't you? That would explain the odd formatting. Lol.

No offense Page, but your arguments have a ring like the late-night infomercials about real estate and cash flow.

As for me:

Current Earnings: 633.19
Federal Tax: 65.94
Social Security: 48.44
Missouri: 14.00
Net Pay: 504.81

YTD:
Gross Pay: 1597.70
Federal Tax: 154.03
Social Security: 122.23
Missouri: 30.00
Net Pay: 1291.44

That's about 6 weeks worth of work. Not bad, but it could be better.

I think it's important to distinguish the difference between, the well off, the rich, and the excedingly rich.


The well off, and the rich DEFINATELY pay their fare share of taxes. So do the excedingly rich.


However, it may not look like they do.


And heres the secret.


They're in debt up passed their ears.

Like, how else do you think a rapper with 4 million dollar contract, and only 2 million in endorsements buys a 20 million dollar house, and 1 million dollars worth of bling?

DEBT SUCKA. DEBT.

Shoot man, if I had that kind of money.. I'd live in a $200,000 house, and FILL IT WITH TECHNOLOGY.

But not modern technology, I'm talking the crap from like 50's "home of tomorrow" crap. That'd be ace and a half.

ROBOT MAID, CLEAN MY CIGAR ASHES.

Yes, that's one thing many people fail to mention. Debt is a killer. Why do you think so many debt consolidation agencies have sprung up? Most people, even those that could be considered "well-off" are in debt up to their ears.

That's one thing I've always admired about my parents. Even though we're a middle-class family, we have no outstanding debts beyond our home and one vehicle, and my mother's schooling (she went back to school to become a nurse). We don't rack up credit card debt at all. My parents taught me to spend money I don't have only rarely, and I appreciate them for it. It makes life so much easier.

It's copied verbatim from Robert Kiyosaki's Rich Dad, Poor Dad.

Of course, blatant plagiarism is still probably better than his other annoying habit of just making **** up. Like "the rich pay little in forms of tax and the middle class ends up carrying the poor."

Oh of course, anything and everything on the net is real and reliable.

"Verify the validity of a source before trusting it" is such a blatantly obvious concept that I thought it needn't be said. Please accept my apologies for overestimating your competence.

The public schools suck up a lot of tax dollars. It's very irritating. Take us for example. My Mom stays home and home-schools us, at our expense. Now, even though we don't use the public schools, we still have to pay money so other kids get a free education, and also, so their parents can work. So my Mom stays home and educate us at zero expense to the state and we don't get any income from her. So in a sense we're paying people to go work for more money. Even worse, most of the kids we pay to educate don't even care about school anyway!

I think Page is ignoring this thread now.

I have to pay taxes to maintain roads in the state of Missouri that I'll never use. It's not fair! I don't want my money to benefit other people!

having an educuated population is a social issue, it helps our economy, and it keeps the highly eduacted/teckinal jobs in this country. i think public education is a good thing that everyone should pay for. oh, and go up to your HS and ask the guy in the office to look up "fees and expenses" for the average student. Free Public eduaton is rarly "free" for the people who go.

You're using the whole roads argument again when in fact roads are such a tiny percentage of our tax expenses that it's not even worth talking about. Regardless, if you consume *anything* from any store anywhere in the country, or even buy stuff off the internet, you are one step removed from using the roads - the vast majority of goods in this country are shipped by truck. And yeah, if you live in the middle of nowhere on a farm and never ever use the roads nor leave your property and are completely self-sufficient, then sure, you shouldn't have to pay road taxes. So you'll save a few cents a year

By the way, where I went to school we had a classroom set of books so we could never take them home to study. We had about 30-35 students per class, we were taught out of portables because the school was too small... But the football field was meticulously maintained, they always had new equipment, and the school provided new uniforms every year. As with any other government agency, the completely abuse the money they have taken and I feel sorry for no school around here that gets its funding cut

not all debt is bad. consumer debt is bad, but investment debt is good b/c you went into debt to buy assets that make you money. In fact, a lot of rich people live below their means, and you wouldn't know they were exceptionally well off by looking at them, but their cashflow speaks for itself. The truly savvy build their financial security using borrowed money.

People that rack up consumer debt in order to maintain the illusion of living the high life are not really rich--- they're simply living well beyond their means and sooner or later it will fall apart. Look at their cashflow. They're probably one paycheck away from total bankruptcy.

Argath: I don't have the facts to back up my claim, are you f***ing happy to know that? I'm certain you are. You won a totally meaningless internet debate. Congratulations.

It still changes nothing. I still support kiyosaki and his claims, and I could probably argue about it with you until the sun burns to cold dark ash and still not convince you. However, its not worth my time.

God man, no wonder you act like you do.. you've never been exposed to anything school is really THERE to expose you to.



Pfft, you thought it was for the book learning? Thats college, not primary school.

Public school is there to expose me to football? Funny, I thought it was there to educate you at least enough to get into a decent university. I thought it was about teaching children, not entertaining them with football games and cheerleading squads.

I'll say this.

If being rich was easy, everyone would be rich, and it would be something you could learn how to do out of a few books.


Seeing as how THIS CRAP changes on a daily basis, it's impossible to say you know the buisness of tax, and tax loopholes, and finances without being some sort of certified tax or fincancial expert. Reading a couple books, or reading things on the internet DOES NOT MEAN YOU KNOW WHAT YOU SPEAK OF. It's also fairly stupid of a person to maintain the idea about themselves that they're OMGFINANCEGOD! NO ONE could possibly know everything concerning finances. Thats insanity. Even then, KNOW ONE is the OMGABSOLUTEGOD! of anything.

Well heres probably where we clash.

I don't think college is for everyone.

Even then, I was just making a joke at Obi-Kwiets expense...



But what REALLY pissed me off about highschool was the lack of support I got from the school for pursuing a technical field.

"Oh here, we know you work hard at what you do, and you might have one of the highest grade averages at the Vo-Tech center... but we're going to **** you around EVERY chance we get... CAUSE WE-INS DON'T LIKE YOU. Because hey, you tell people going to college isn't for everyone, and you prove that college isn't for everyone. Also you're telling people they don't have to go into the military, by convincing them that they aren't useless."


Shoot man, counselors at my school would FLAT OUT tell kids to join the millitary straight out of highschool because they didn't have the aptitude for college... What kind of crap is that?


The kind of crap some schools do is just... UHG.

And yeah, sports in general always seemed like a pointless endeavor to me. And why by them new equipment every year? The hell do they need new stuff for, their old stuff is FINE?

And what FURTHER pissed me off, is that the football team got ALL OF THE SPORTS FUNDING. While other sports had to HOLD FUNDRAISERS JUST TO GET BASIC THINGS, LIKE GOAL NETS, OR BALLS...

I mean seriously... WTFmate.


But that rant is over.

It is fairly easy, but it's not a walk in the park. all you have to do is spend your life acquiring income-producing assets, and you will be rich. You will have to work your a** off in the first few years, but eventually your cashflow becomes self-sustaining, and then you will be financiallly free. I'm going to start the process as soon as I get out of college, right now I'm building my credit and learning all I can. My goal is to own my first multi-unit building by age 27.


The problem is that most of us have been conditioned to expect to work a safe, secure job until age 65. The thought of leaving security behind and trying something so radically different to what they have been brought up to believe is terrifying for most people. They prefer financial security over financial freedom, as Kiyosaki puts it.

I know this stuff works. People in my family have done it, and people that I know outside of my family have done it. if they can do it, I can do it too.

I'll make sure to tell the immigrants, and convincts building the houses down the block that being rich in America is super easy, and that they weren't lied to regarding the American Dream.

And no, we haven't been conditioned to go AGAINST a secure job. We've been conditioned to realize that the law of averages SUCKS, and that seriously, if you could learn getting rich out of a book, or from something offered in an infomercial, that every idiot that buys into this crap would be filty, dirty, stinking, smelly rich.


And yeah, I know a person, that knows a person that got rich too.

6 degrees to Kevin Bacon doesn't apply to financial gain.