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☖ Forums → Discussion Forum → Is it possible to (learn to) draw good without natural talent?
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Is it possible to (learn to) draw good without natural talent?
2006-01-14, 6:51 PM #1
I always LOVED drawing, and drew for days (and I *do* mean days) when I was a kid. And I was ways better than I am now. Thing is - I LOVE to draw, but most of the stuff I draw now I really dislike as it sucks donkey balls. Which kind of kills my motivation.

So, do you think if it's possible to learn to draw good without being a natural? And I'm talking about comic-book style illustrations, btw. Not paintings. Heh.
幻術
2006-01-14, 6:55 PM #2
You can teach yourself important techniques and things. Natural talent plays a factor, but not as much as you might think. What's important is understanding the basic concepts, and of course taking your time. There used to be a great site with some of Andrew Loomis' books available in electronic form, but it was taken down after a letter of removal. Look around for tutorials and things, but know that you'll have to filter the good from the bad pretty often.
Marsz, marsz, Dąbrowski,
Z ziemi włoskiej do Polski,
Za twoim przewodem
Złączym się z narodem.
2006-01-14, 7:24 PM #3
Taking your time doesn't play a factor in any of the drawings I do--only in technical/mechanical drawings does it help. Knowing the concepts, knowing the general shape of figures, experimentation, and artistic vision are all what push me to draw what I do (which most people agree is pretty good, though I'd not say anywhere near good/great or professional stuff).
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 7:57 PM #4
I'm going to say yes but only because, I don't think one can have natural talent. I think you just need to practice a whole lot. And show it to people, ask for critiques. That part is fun all by itself. I think, find something that inspires you. For me, watching The Lord of The Rings movies makes me want to draw. Find something like that and keep going back to it. Basically, I'm just encouraging you to draw. ;)
2006-01-14, 7:57 PM #5
I'd love to learn to draw, especially on the computer, but I suck. So do my pictures.
"Harriet, sweet Harriet - hard-hearted harbinger of haggis."
2006-01-14, 8:00 PM #6
I don't believe in "natural talent." Unless you are physically unable to perform a potential talent, there is no reason why it can't be learned. Bear in mind that not everyone learns the same things at the same rate, and it may be something you learn quickly, or something you learn slowly. It's all in how your mind processes information.

A skill must be practiced in order to become perfected. You don't "just have" skills. As an example, for some time I was learning to do computer graphics, and was slowly beginning to get good at it. Then after a computer crash and loosing over 700 MB worth of work, I became discouraged and gave up on it. As of recently, I've tried to get back into it, and have been unable to do so. Which brings me to point #2:

A skill must also be maintained.
Catloaf, meet mouseloaf.
My music
2006-01-14, 8:01 PM #7
Draw well! Well I tell you!

*explodes*
SnailIracing:n(500tpostshpereline)pants
-----------------------------@%
2006-01-14, 8:10 PM #8
Originally posted by DogSRoOL:
I don't believe in "natural talent." Unless you are physically unable to perform a potential talent, there is no reason why it can't be learned. Bear in mind that not everyone learns the same things at the same rate, and it may be something you learn quickly, or something you learn slowly. It's all in how your mind processes information.

A skill must be practiced in order to become perfected. You don't "just have" skills. As an example, for some time I was learning to do computer graphics, and was slowly beginning to get good at it. Then after a computer crash and loosing over 700 MB worth of work, I became discouraged and gave up on it. As of recently, I've tried to get back into it, and have been unable to do so. Which brings me to point #2:

A skill must also be maintained.

This, as an artist, makes me laugh. From what I've seen (most of my friends are artists as well by the way) you are 100% wrong here.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 8:11 PM #9
I said yes, largely because otherwise, I have no hope of getting anywhere with my major ;)
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2006-01-14, 8:26 PM #10
[QUOTE=Dj Yoshi]This, as an artist, makes me laugh. From what I've seen (most of my friends are artists as well by the way) you are 100% wrong here.[/QUOTE]

Don't be so hasty to judge. The skills I'm sure are still there, just familiarity with the software may not be. For instance, a couple of years ago I used Blender constantly. I haven't really used it in a while, and I'm rather out of touch with the software. I still know the concepts of modeling, I just need to go back and relearn how to apply them using the software.
Marsz, marsz, Dąbrowski,
Z ziemi włoskiej do Polski,
Za twoim przewodem
Złączym się z narodem.
2006-01-14, 8:31 PM #11
Originally posted by Ric_Olie:
Don't be so hasty to judge. The skills I'm sure are still there, just familiarity with the software may not be. For instance, a couple of years ago I used Blender constantly. I haven't really used it in a while, and I'm rather out of touch with the software. I still know the concepts of modeling, I just need to go back and relearn how to apply them using the software.

Well, he edited his post. Originally it didn't say all that. I was mainly talking about the part of his post that said there's no such thing as natural talent.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 9:36 PM #12
practice practice practice.

There was a guy on conceptart.org who started off not knowing a thing about drawing and after a few months of practice he improved greatly.

Take a class if you can, they really help.
[01:52] <~Nikumubeki> Because it's MBEGGAR BEGS LIKE A BEGONI.
2006-01-14, 9:37 PM #13
Originally posted by MBeggar:
practice practice practice.

There was a guy on conceptart.org who started off not knowing a thing about drawing and after a few months of practice he improved greatly.

Take a class if you can, they really help.

See this is what I'm saying. Natural talent won't show its face at first--but some progress faster and better than others. That's when you know they have better/more talent.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 9:40 PM #14
http://www.questionablecontent.net

The guy's art was kind of crappy at the beginning of the comic. Take a look through the archives, and watch the evolution. This atleast is some evidence that you can become better at something by doing it three times a week, moving on up to five times a week.
Daddy, why doesn't this magnet pick up this floppy disk?
2006-01-14, 9:59 PM #15
No amount of training will ever make me a decent artist.
If you think the waiters are rude, you should see the manager.
2006-01-14, 9:59 PM #16
Copy paintings, as quickly as you can.

Thats how you learn lighting.

Drawing/painthing/photography are really only measurements and interpretations of lighting.

Where as with photography you only have to be able to line up good shots.

Really though, texture and lighting are the most important things you can teach yourself, and the best way to learn lighting patterns is from quick studies.


Also, don't be afraid to copy a technique you've seen somewhere else. ALL ART IS STEALING. THE END, KTHX.
2006-01-14, 10:00 PM #17
Originally posted by Rob:
Copy paintings, as quickly as you can.

Thats how you learn lighting.

Drawing/painthing/photography are really only measurements and interpretations of lighting.

Where as with photography you only have to be able to line up good shots.

Really though, texture and lighting are the most important things you can teach yourself, and the best way to learn lighting patterns is from quick studies.


Also, don't be afraid to copy a technique you've seen somewhere else. ALL ART IS STEALING. THE END, KTHX.

What? No...
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 10:03 PM #18
YES.

Ha.

No really, thats just how I taught myself to paint.

To be honest, I wanted to see what people would say.

The bit about light, thats for real though. Light is probably the easiest way to make something look real.
2006-01-14, 10:06 PM #19
Originally posted by Rob:
YES.

Ha.

No really, thats just how I taught myself to paint.

To be honest, I wanted to see what people would say.

The bit about light, thats for real though. Light is probably the easiest way to make something look real.

I'm talking about the "All art is copying" bit. Everyone learns differently...but I NEVER copy artwork, or if I do it's very loosely with my own spin on it.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 10:08 PM #20
You do, wether you think you do or not.

Basic, THE MOST BASIC, techniques are copying the artists that developed them.

Thank god for the Renaissance, otherwise we'd still be stuck in caveman-sucktown.
2006-01-14, 10:08 PM #21
From my experiance you have to have a basic natural talent for it. I suppose you can get pretty good at it if you practice 24/7, but I'd say a natural person with marginal practice could be as good or better than someone spends all day practicing.
2006-01-14, 10:10 PM #22
Originally posted by Rob:
You do, wether you think you do or not.

Basic, THE MOST BASIC, techniques are copying the artists that developed them.

Thank god for the Renaissance, otherwise we'd still be stuck in caveman-sucktown.

No...and that kind of thinking is stupid. If there's anything that coding has taught me is that there's a difference between Copying and Reinventing the Wheel. A big difference.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 10:12 PM #23
Coding != ART

HA, thats good. What with the coding symbol and what not.

It's kind of like the difference between Technical drawings, blueprints or diagrams, and art.
2006-01-14, 10:16 PM #24
Originally posted by Rob:
Coding != ART

HA, thats good. What with the coding symbol and what not.

It's kind of like the difference between Technical drawings, blueprints or diagrams, and art.

Not really. I was making a reference--I learned all my techniques myself. Maybe one or two I'll use once in a while I learned somewhere. But I almost never use those.

Not only that, but there's also your own style which, unless all you do is copy other people (which that's not what I do) you end up developing after making art for a while.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 10:20 PM #25
I can almost guarantee at one point or another you've been exposed to art, that you are subconciously emulating.

Cave-painting to the renaissance to now.

Compare.
2006-01-14, 10:25 PM #26
Originally posted by Rob:
I can almost guarantee at one point or another you've been exposed to art, that you are subconciously emulating.

Cave-painting to the renaissance to now.

Compare.

I can 100% guarantee you're judging people and thinking you're right while simultaneously not knowing said people and being wrong.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 10:27 PM #27
I can guarantee you suck.

And the last thing you showed on here sucked.
2006-01-14, 10:31 PM #28
I know most of massassi disagrees.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 10:36 PM #29
That you suck?

Think again. :)
2006-01-14, 10:39 PM #30
Originally posted by Rob:
Coding != ART


I'm not calling you on this or anything, but I have heard from some very proficient programmers that programming is truly an art, which they say is very evident at the higher levels. The claim that past a certain point, it's not really a science and not heavily mathematical; the only way to describe it is art. Very similar to painting a picture.

Thought I'd throw that out there. It fascinates me.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2006-01-14, 10:41 PM #31
Saying something is an art, and something being art are too very different things.

Being a good machinist is an art, painting is art.
2006-01-14, 10:43 PM #32
Originally posted by Rob:
That you suck?

Think again. :)

http://yoshmaista.shockzero.com/colne.png

How about we let them decide. It's not amazing, it's not great, but it is good. (trust me, I'm already aware of the flaws in it so you don't need to list them out.)
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 11:00 PM #33
Meh, generic Night Elf cartoon.
The one time I actually agree with Rob.
2006-01-14, 11:05 PM #34
Generic...ish...but not bad. Certainly not bad. Besides, this is coming from Beastiality boy.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 11:06 PM #35
Bestiality boy? ...do I want to know?
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2006-01-14, 11:06 PM #36
Since posting a hilarious video of Iraqi's humpin a donkey has anything to do with your art. I mean, it's not bad, but it could be better y'know? I'm not trying to be a butthole about it, it's just my opinion.
2006-01-14, 11:12 PM #37
[QUOTE=Dj Yoshi]http://yoshmaista.shockzero.com/colne.png

How about we let them decide. It's not amazing, it's not great, but it is good. (trust me, I'm already aware of the flaws in it so you don't need to list them out.)[/QUOTE]

I. Rest. My. Case.
2006-01-14, 11:13 PM #38
Originally posted by -Monoxide-:
Since posting a hilarious video of Iraqi's humpin a donkey has anything to do with your art. I mean, it's not bad, but it could be better y'know? I'm not trying to be a butthole about it, it's just my opinion.

Exactly, it's not bad.

Free--no, no you don't. Though it is funny, it's more sad than anything.
D E A T H
2006-01-14, 11:15 PM #39
Oh yeah, I remember that now. I thought it was funny.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2006-01-14, 11:34 PM #40
I think it's possible if you learn the techniques. I know I have this "natural talent" but I don't do anything with it. If I actually could stand to sit in an art class, I'd probably be awesome. I think it all lies in the will to actually want to be an artist.
"Ford, you're turning into a penguin. Stop it."
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