Since mb is too lazy to ban me, why don't we all get together, sit down, and have a nice chat while killing each other with rockets, turrets, and miniguns?

Anyone up for a game?

EDIT: WE'RE DOING THIS TOMORROW TODAY, SATURDAY OCTOBER 4TH

64.251.22.40:27015

THE TIME IS PERHAPS 6:30 CST (THAT'S -06:00 GMT)

Yes, depending on times.

We're talking about PC? If so, sounds fun.
Note: I suck at TF2

Also, I might be drunk.

I'm up. I just bought it a couple days ago so I'm not very good yet. What time/server? Also, I'll be smashed.

I get off work in an hour or so.

Server? I don't know, I usually play on goon servers. Anyone have a suggestion?

Does anyone have a guest pass? I just downloaded steam and realized I have just about every HL related game with the exception of TF2.

I'm up as long as we specify a time rather than just saying "go look!" like they did last time.

I might start something up in 30 minutes of this post. Going to make dinner first.

I'll start playing with someone if they pick a good server, then I'll post the server information on here

Man, I'd be up for it if I wasn't drunk. And also if it wasn't half one in the morning.

Then again, I could always just play Demoman. Oh well.

I take offense to the above eng.

I play spy exclusively.

Please state the time and server. In the thread.

OMFG HURRRY I WANNA PLAY

I'll reiterate it again.

Please state time and server i.p. in the thread. Let's not **** it up like last time. Thank you.

Well, it's official.

Anovis screwed it up.

Yeah.

As I said, I don't know any good public servers.

Does anyone?

Seriously. Someone choose a server. Then we'll play on it

I just used the server in the meatfortress 2 thread. I'm in as an engineer right now

Yay tomorrow! Oh wait, it's passed midnight now.

How far apart are BST and CST? I think it's seven hours or so.

And I'm up for it. Hopefully this time there'll be more than three people.

I think its 12:30 here.

Baconfish is correct, we're -6:00 GMT

It's not insta-respawn server silliness, right?

I never played on it before, so unless someone has a better server in mind, I really suck at picking out pubbie servers.

The ones I usually play on are all semi-instant (like 2-3 second) respawns. I much perfer them as you have to be much more strategic.

Really? Because insta-spawn servers are just spam fests.

So do people like instant respawns, semi-instant, or the 10 seconds?

Personally, I like default timer. Playing Dustbowl, Goldrush, Badwater and similar maps are near impossible for the advancing team to win with insta-spawning or very shortened.

Then again, if it's going to be like 4 vs 4, default won't work.

Maybe on crappy servers they are. But those types usually result in draws/defense winning all the time.

It's actually far more strategic because you simply can't use up one uber and expect to overpower the other team completely, as you can on normal respawn servers. You have to plan out much more, build up more ubers, and fight for every inch of land.

The reason it doesn't work as you'd expect is even if you spam, the other side is spamming right back. If you want to be victorious, you have to use a different method. On normal respawn servers, a few lucky kills can result in a complete decimation of the other team. For example:

Map: Dustbowl
First Area

Blue team overruns the Red defense for the first point with overwhelming ubers. Half the Red Team dies.

Blue team then rushes down the middle as soon as they capture the first point, arriving at the second point just as the Red team begins to respawn.

Blue team captures the second point before the Red team is even able to reach the second point, resulting in a near instantaneous win.

However, on an instant respawn server, you may be able to overwhelm them at the first point, but a simple blind rush will not net you a win on the second point, as by that point Red team would have already respawned and started rebuilding their defense. You then have to use more strategy, capture all of the entrances to the second point, and distribute ubers in a thoughtful way so to overwhelm the Red team all at once. Even then it is difficult, but it makes the game far more challenging overall, instead of an "OMG ZERGLING RUSH!!!" game. It just feels more like how TF2 was intended to be played, in my opinion.

I don't mind playing on normal respawn servers, I just find these much more entertaining. If I want slow respawn I'll go play CSS

I'll play. I get off work at 7:30 CST, I think.

Personally playing on goon servers, I like both default and the 5 second ones. Insta respawns suck because it doesn't encourage you to not suck so much.

I only see that happen when the defense team are the most incompetent players ever. Most players know if the first point is nearly lost, they build defenses on the second. It doesn't have to be completely captured to know the obvious.



Fact of the matter is, the time it takes for the BLU team to travel back from respawn to the front lines is significantly longer than it takes for the RED team to step outside and guard the point that's 2 feet away. If the teams were evenly matched in skill and both knew what they are doing, the BLU team gets decimated. That's not balanced. RED team can just easily camp and wait for the enemy team to come to them. If RED is remotely competent, they would just Demo spam the tight corners and pathways in Dustbowl.

Respawn times give a consequence for failure.



Then TFC is right up your alley.

I know a couple of pretty awesome default spawn servers, but theyre almost always full.

I don't know what kind of players you play with, but when we cap the point it happens in less than 5 seconds after we reach it. There is no time to run back and build defenses, and besides, you can't cover all points of entry with half your team dead. It only takes about 2 seconds on the point with 3 people to cap the second point. A couple spies could sit back there and win it almost instantly. Not possible on a fast respawn server.



What is this about traveling back from respawn? You rush immediately after capturing the first point, there is no running from spawn there. You can reach that second point before Red team really even respawns on normal respawn.

If the BLU team is competent, a demo spamming Red team would be thrown back in spawn in seconds. Instant/fast respawn levels the playing field. Long respawn times are NOT:


It is not a consequence for failure, it's a punishment. Not only do you lose the first point, you lose the second, automatically. If that's supposedly a consequence then that is ridiculous. You don't need respawn times. A good team will ALWAYS beat a bad team in instant/fast respawn. It doesn't matter what side you're on. However, in normal respawn, it's almost never about skill, but how fast you can rush to the next point.

So you do play with incompetent players. Suicide rushing a point that you know is done for is terrible idea. And people know about ninja-spy cap tricks by now. It has been pretty much a year TF2 is out now.

A well coordinated defense team isn't going to throw themselves away to fight off a defeated point. No, they will slow down the advancement until the rest of the team can respawn.

It's TF2 Basics: 101.

Not only that, Dustbowl doesn't have that many pathways. Everyone knows where you are coming to advance. If it's a Payload map with moving a bomb, everyone knows where the objective coming from.



I'm taking about insta-spawning. BLU team has to traverse, which takes time. RED just has to step outside and camp.




So you do play with terrible people. It doesn't level the playing field, and Valve knows this. In TFC, it was leveled with insta-spawning in mind.

If you look at the stats (which Valve says they do not incorporate modded severs):



It's fairly even, no? The only map that isn't even is Goldrush, which is admittedly harder for advancing team when it comes to moving a slow-*** bomb cart to the final point.




So you never play on normal respawn servers, ever?

15 seconds isn't ridiculous. It's only bad for people who can't comprehend that blindly rushing into the enemy isn't the best idea. If you honestly dying over and over, and it's 15 second wait times for every 3 seconds of play time, you suck at TF2. A respawn time gives player an encouragement to play well.



But I restate: If it's only a few players, I agree respawn times are too long. Such as in the case of 6 vs 6 or similar numbers.

If I'm home I'll play. I've only played it like twice, so I'm probably going to suck hard/need people to explain what's different between TFC and TF2 (from what I remember, it's practically everything).

I'll try to make it.

Do you not understand the basics of ubers and rushing? I mean, really... it's like you haven't played with ubers before. Uber demo rushes the canyon and blows up ALL the sentries on the point, then you have a pyro uber rush the point, and maybe another uber if you're on a bigger team. The rest of the team goes left, rushes out, and comes from behind as soon as the sentries are down. Their responsibility is to take the points as fast as possible, as well as making sure the ubers reach their positions without being blocked.

TF2 Basics: 102.



Dustbowl has 4/5 different ways of coming on the second point, and 3 very dispersed ones for the 1st point!



Have you ever timed how long it takes to run from point 1 to point 2? Also, you don't just "step outside", you step outside, go around the bend, and run the gauntlet across the open field. It takes you a minimum of 5 seconds just to get from spawn to the second point. It doesn't take 15 seconds to go from point 1 to point 2, and even if you get there the same time red does, you're still boned, because the second point captures ridiculously fast. A pyro and medic can capture the point solo if they want, they just sit there and compressed air blast anyone and anything coming at it until it captures (about 2-3 seconds).




Instant respawn is not a mod. Those stats incorporate almost ever fast respawn/instant respawn server out there.



Useless stats are useless, for reason noted above.




If you believe that's how instant respawn servers are really played, then you, sir, are the poor inexperienced player here. No one is that stupid. But seriously, why even toss back and forth who's "more experienced" when it's not about experience, it's about plan cold facts which I have already demonstrated.

As I said before, I don't care about normal respawn, I used to play on them for quite a while, but it's boring watching the same tactics get abused over and over because the system's rules simply disallow one team from coming back from a hard push or well timed uber.

I'm excited! That's in about 1 hour 20 minutes, no?