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☖ Forums → Discussion Forum → Suicide on the net
12
Suicide on the net
2008-11-22, 11:42 AM #1
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/11/21/webcam.suicide/index.html

Read this in the paper today. Our world is permanently screwed up. Sure, it's not the first time this has happened, but still... disturbing...
"Harriet, sweet Harriet - hard-hearted harbinger of haggis."
2008-11-22, 11:48 AM #2
Bloody blog/webcam/YouTube Internet generation.
Star Wars: TODOA | DXN - Deus Ex: Nihilum
2008-11-22, 11:57 AM #3
good riddance
Peace is a lie
There is only passion
Through passion I gain strength
Through strength I gain power
Through power I gain victory
Through victory my chains are broken
The Force shall set me free
2008-11-22, 12:00 PM #4
I always miss the best shows. ):
error; function{getsig} returns 'null'
2008-11-22, 12:01 PM #5
Originally posted by Chewbubba:
Our world is permanently screwed up.


I'm sorry, this is nothing new.
twitter | flickr | last.fm | facebook |
2008-11-22, 12:05 PM #6
The whole video thing is pretty ****ed up.

However, this is even more ****ed up:
Quote:
Some of those watching urged him to take more drugs while others debated whether he had taken enough to kill himself.

They all should be prosecuted.
Code to the left of him, code to the right of him, code in front of him compil'd and thundered. Programm'd at with shot and $SHELL. Boldly he typed and well. Into the jaws of C. Into the mouth of PERL. Debug'd the 0x258.
2008-11-22, 12:10 PM #7
Originally posted by dalf:
The whole video thing is pretty ****ed up.

However, this is even more ****ed up:

They all should be prosecuted.


For what? If the guy wanted to commit suicide, why should anyone be prosecuted for it?
[This message has been edited. Deal with it.]
2008-11-22, 12:13 PM #8
To be honest, there is alot of bulls**t on the internet. So it can't be expected for people to believe this to be real right away. in the chatroom.

Massassi should know this. I mean, if I recall, a certain Finn "died" a few years ago, it found out otherwise. No?
SnailIracing:n(500tpostshpereline)pants
-----------------------------@%
2008-11-22, 12:13 PM #9
Lt_Greywolf, anyone?
Star Wars: TODOA | DXN - Deus Ex: Nihilum
2008-11-22, 12:14 PM #10
Google has the forum post cached and it was posted on digg, apparently the teen made suicidal threats every month on the forum.
twitter | flickr | last.fm | facebook |
2008-11-22, 12:15 PM #11
Originally posted by FastGamerr:
Lt_Greywolf, anyone?


Oh yeah. Him too.
SnailIracing:n(500tpostshpereline)pants
-----------------------------@%
2008-11-22, 12:20 PM #12
Originally posted by Malus:
For what? If the guy wanted to commit suicide, why should anyone be prosecuted for it?

They (presumably) knew he was suicidal and that taking loads of benzodiazipine was the means to the ultimate end and they were encouraging him along. The DA should seriously think about pressing murder charges. Encouraging suicide is murder in my opinion.
Code to the left of him, code to the right of him, code in front of him compil'd and thundered. Programm'd at with shot and $SHELL. Boldly he typed and well. Into the jaws of C. Into the mouth of PERL. Debug'd the 0x258.
2008-11-22, 12:22 PM #13
Huh, how is that considered murder?

They may have been bad influence. But they didn't give him the pills.
SnailIracing:n(500tpostshpereline)pants
-----------------------------@%
2008-11-22, 12:49 PM #14
Yeah they might have not fed the pills directly to him but they still had thought out, cognitive desire to have someone die.
Code to the left of him, code to the right of him, code in front of him compil'd and thundered. Programm'd at with shot and $SHELL. Boldly he typed and well. Into the jaws of C. Into the mouth of PERL. Debug'd the 0x258.
2008-11-22, 1:03 PM #15
Originally posted by dalf:
Yeah they might have not fed the pills directly to him but they still had thought out, cognitive desire to have someone die.


The guy committing suicide also has a though out, cognitive desire to have someone die.
[This message has been edited. Deal with it.]
2008-11-22, 1:11 PM #16
but he can't be put on death row for it anymore
2008-11-22, 1:12 PM #17
Originally posted by dalf:
Yeah they might have not fed the pills directly to him but they still had thought out, cognitive desire to have someone die.


so if i tell you to go kill yourself, and you do... then i am responsible?

i mean i know where your coming from here, but i dont think prosecution for murder would be appropriate.
Welcome to the douchebag club. We'd give you some cookies, but some douche ate all of them. -Rob
2008-11-22, 1:14 PM #18
Originally posted by Malus:
The guy committing suicide also has a though out, cognitive desire to have someone die.

Yeah himself. Last I understood, suicide is not illegal. Yes it ****s up a lot of people mainly emotional but no crime has been committed.

That teen could still be alive today if they had discouraged suicide. Rather than that, they encouraged him to pop more pills. And now he's dead.
Code to the left of him, code to the right of him, code in front of him compil'd and thundered. Programm'd at with shot and $SHELL. Boldly he typed and well. Into the jaws of C. Into the mouth of PERL. Debug'd the 0x258.
2008-11-22, 1:18 PM #19
Murder is illegal. Suicide is murdering yourself. Only they can't prosecute the felon, so no dice. :/
2008-11-22, 1:19 PM #20
Originally posted by Squirrel King:
Murder is illegal. Suicide is murdering yourself. Only they can't prosecute the felon, so no dice. :/

So if my suicide attempt is botched and I surive, do I get charged for attempted murder?
Code to the left of him, code to the right of him, code in front of him compil'd and thundered. Programm'd at with shot and $SHELL. Boldly he typed and well. Into the jaws of C. Into the mouth of PERL. Debug'd the 0x258.
2008-11-22, 1:22 PM #21
Originally posted by TimeWolfOfThePast:
Google has the forum post cached and it was posted on digg, apparently the teen made suicidal threats every month on the forum.


A sign that someone is really asking for help. Even though it's a retarded way to do it.
"Harriet, sweet Harriet - hard-hearted harbinger of haggis."
2008-11-22, 1:53 PM #22
Originally posted by Chewbubba:
A sign that someone is really asking for help. Even though it's a retarded way to do it.


It is difficult to distinguish a call for help from a call for attention on the internet. This is especially the case if you threaten to do it month after month but never go through with it. I can imagine it would be hard to take the guy seriously after all of his nonsense.
[This message has been edited. Deal with it.]
2008-11-22, 2:14 PM #23
Originally posted by dalf:
That teen could still be alive today if they he had discouraged not commited suicide. Rather than that, they encouraged him to pop more pills thought he was joking, just as quite a few of us would if a member claimed to be taking pills on a webcam. And now he's dead.


Oh noes! Scum of society!

I'm sorry, it's sad he took his life and all that, but I don't get the hubbub that the forum members didn't take him seriously.
omnia mea mecum porto
2008-11-22, 2:45 PM #24
Heh, this is exactly the same as:
http://technology.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/tech_and_web/article1560877.ece
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. " - Bertrand Russell
The Triumph of Stupidity in Mortals and Others 1931-1935
2008-11-22, 3:10 PM #25
i blame 4chan
2008-11-22, 3:39 PM #26
Aw that's such an awful thong to do :(
Last edited by mb; today at 10:55 AM.
2008-11-22, 3:39 PM #27
Originally posted by dalf:
Yeah they might have not fed the pills directly to him but they still had thought out, cognitive desire to have someone die.


For a crime you need both mens reas and actus reas and the latter is what would be a huge ***** to prove.

Also, regarding suicide as a crime:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_views_of_suicide#United_States


This whole thing does suck though. I read that article yesterday and it made me grr.
一个大西瓜
2008-11-23, 12:32 AM #28
Originally posted by Chewbubba:
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/11/21/webcam.suicide/index.html

Read this in the paper today. Our world is permanently screwed up. Sure, it's not the first time this has happened, but still... disturbing...


Pfft, don't drag the world into this... the world is fine.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2008-11-23, 12:37 AM #29
Originally posted by dalf:
They (presumably) knew he was suicidal and that taking loads of benzodiazipine was the means to the ultimate end and they were encouraging him along. The DA should seriously think about pressing murder charges. Encouraging suicide is murder in my opinion.


Suicide is not even close to murder, dalf... that's just going overboard.

For one, suicide is the fulfillment of a desire... it's 'consentual.'

You can do whatever the hell you want with your own body. To claim otherwise is to claim that you are not in ownership of your own body and that some other entity is. Such as the state. Which of course is utter bollocks.

Murder is the non consentual termination of life..
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2008-11-23, 3:20 AM #30
One would argue that the desire to end your own life goes against the natural instincts of self-preservation, and as suicidal desires fall quite well outside the norm of average reasoning it stands to qualify as a mental disorder.

Now you could argue until you are blue in the face that this is not always the case - and I'm sure it isn't - but when it comes to matters of a person's life I don't think anyone would contend that it would be inappropriate to assume sucidial desires are the result of some form of mental illness or impairment where a person is not of rational mind, and should be given care and treatment with the hope of bettering their wellbeing. And in this situation, to stand by and do nothing is most certainly a crime.
2008-11-23, 9:26 AM #31
Originally posted by Pommy:
For a crime you need both mens reas and actus reas and the latter is what would be a huge ***** to prove.


This is right. To be more specific, murder requires causing a death (actus reus) purposely, knowingly, or in some circumstances having consciously disregarded a substantial risk (mens rea). The people watching probably didn't commit an act that caused a death, and even if they did you'd have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they actually knew of a risk that what they were doing would cause a death.

Depending on how the state's "assisting suicide" law is written, they might be on the hook for that.
If you think the waiters are rude, you should see the manager.
2008-11-23, 11:10 PM #32
Originally posted by Freelancer:
Pfft, don't drag the world into this... the world is fine.


i thought it had a fever :confused:
Welcome to the douchebag club. We'd give you some cookies, but some douche ate all of them. -Rob
2008-11-23, 11:31 PM #33
anyone else find this ironic?
2008-11-23, 11:46 PM #34
Not really. In fact, I'm suprised this doesn't happen more often.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2008-11-24, 12:36 AM #35
hm. i doubt if he pulled out a gun or a knife they would have cheered him on, they probably thought he was faking it
2008-11-24, 1:37 AM #36
Originally posted by Reid:
hm. i doubt if he pulled out a gun or a knife they would have cheered him on, they probably thought he was faking it


that really depends on who the audience was. as sad as it is to admit it, there are portions of the population that are big enough arsehats that they would cheer it on no matter what.
Welcome to the douchebag club. We'd give you some cookies, but some douche ate all of them. -Rob
2008-11-24, 3:05 PM #37
He was probably going to do it anyways. I really can't find myself upset.

Friends of mine and people I know have killed themselves, really if things are sooo soo soo ****ing bad for them let them go for it.
2008-11-24, 4:30 PM #38
Quote:
Last I understood, suicide is not illegal.

Don't forget about physician-assisted suicide. I don't think that's legal.

Quote:
This is right. To be more specific, murder requires causing a death (actus reus) purposely, knowingly, or in some circumstances having consciously disregarded a substantial risk (mens rea). The people watching probably didn't commit an act that caused a death, and even if they did you'd have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they actually knew of a risk that what they were doing would cause a death.
You forgot negligence.

Normally I have zero sympathy for people who commit suicide. I still don't in this situation, but I do understand that the people were asses. Can't go to jail for telling someone they should kill themself, joking or not.
Democracy: rule by the stupid
2008-11-24, 5:05 PM #39
Originally posted by Kieran Horn:
You forgot negligence.


The omission was intentional. I don't know of anywhere in the U.S. where negligence is sufficient to prove murder. I'm willing to be corrected on that though.
If you think the waiters are rude, you should see the manager.
2008-11-24, 5:47 PM #40
You'd also have to prove that these people could have had reasonable suspicion that this guy was actually killing himself rather than simply being another drama queen.
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