Exactly. Well said. Attack crime, not rights. Take criminals off the streets, don't create more.

Well, yes, he's saying improve gun control, not make it tighter. To me, that implies what you are saying. It may not be very feasible but I think that's his point.

Emon's bang on. You have to continually strive to have better gun control, which isn't necessarily tighter.

On the exact same hand though, you're right about coming at it from the other side with equal vigour. Tough penalties for those with illegal guns are very much something I would be behind.

I suppose the misunderstanding comes from the phrase "gun control." Almost universally, in the US, when one refers to "gun control" they are speaking of the "wrong way" initiatives - those that affect citizens. "Gun Control" in the US has been synonymous with "get rid of guns" and/or "take away rights."

So was I, and I have a mate who's a drummer and fits his kit in the back of a Clio.

ELECTRONIC DRUMS DON'T COUNT.

Beside, some people have lots of toms and crash cymbals, some don't. There are also a thousand different drum stands. Some take up more space than others. No one cares about your friend and his Clio.

So then whats your tundra?

Theres a guy around here who owns an F650, I think that is a bit overkill, but I still have to admire it haha.




Yeahhh anyone who fits their kit in their car doesn't play a 6 piece kit with a rack. I wasn't talking about your standard 4 piece jazz kit.

There's a couple of those around here too. Maybe overkill, but still kinda makes me proud

The nearest thing I can think of that this truck reminds me of is a giant turtle. Don't know why, but thats what comes to mind when I look at it.

Heh, what's the deal with light duty trucks, anyway? The rivalry between Chevy, Ford and others seems to be about brand more than any actual objective quality.

I can't shake the fact that it seems a lot of people buy F-150s because they think they're "Built Ford tough :haw:" :downs:

I suppose it's all cultural and related to ones own experience. In Central Asia, it's seen as perfectly normal to walk around with automatic rifles, for protection. They could not imagine life otherwise. In parts of the United States, it's seen as perfectly normal to walk around with a handgun concealed on your person, for protection. They could not imagine life otherwise. Clearly, any mention of it would be stepping outside of my cultural bounds.

Similarly, the soccer mom in the Lexus SUV driving 55 mph on a local road in torrential rain with two pudgy brats in the back and talking on the cell phone to her wopdaego mobster wannabe husband selling bad investments at work believing she's perfectly safe to not watch the road because she's driving a huge behemoth has as much of a legitimate reason to own an SUV as a contractor to own a van or truck.

It's a matter of human geography. In a densely populated suburban area, where a large number of people are not in the trades, SUVs only make traffic worse and increase the number of accidents. Here the only people who own Jeeps are frat boys who've never grown up.

That won't be the same in other parts of the country. Go and have fun hauling loads and fording rivers. Let your kids carry guns in case the two black guys in the town attack them. It's not my concern.

I don't know what a Rack is, but otherwise yes, yes he does. You obviously didn't play enough Tetris as a kid.

And I was mistaken, he has a Corsa now. Also, an SUV is still a car.

I know a dumbass neocon (incidentally who is gay and opposes gay marriage :huh:) who drives an SUV and legitimately thinks it gets him more mileage than a compact car because he "dominates more of the road."

Poes Law?

Drum rack:




I find them incredibly handy for most venues. Just place everything on the rack where its already been adjusted and everything is in the exact same place as you left it. Makes set up time a piece of cake.

I prefer not to play drum tetris, thats how things get broken

yeah i'd like to see my friend get his kit into a clio... 2 bass drums, 5 toms, a snare, and a crapload of cymbals

and yes... there is a cowbell too

That's why they invented cases.

People against gun control are overly defensive, the government doesn't have any mass plot to steal anyone's rights. The government wants to reduce violent crimes, especially those involving firearms. Most likely, tighter gun control will make it easier to both solve violent crimes involving firearms and will likely prevent some. And, guess what? You still get to keep your guns.

You have way to much faith in the federal government.

Okay, well describe to me the err of my logic

The problem is like we said on the last page: much like DRM not affecting pirates, tight gun control doesn't affect criminals.

If it were that easy, the problem would have been solved

True to a certain degree.

Saying DRM doesn't effect pirates is an understatement, saying it's doing it's job is an overstatement.

DRM often causes pirates.
I had to crack Clear Sky just so I could bloody play.

That's the dumbest thing I've heard in a while, tibby

What? You expect me to sit around while Clear Sky complains about how many times I installed it, even though I bought that very day?

The government doesn't have to have a mass plot to steal rights...it just comes naturally to them (which is the same as saying "to us"). We all want to disarm the rest of the people, whether we ourselves are armed or not.

Let's put it this way: The right to ownership of guns as identified in the constitution is intended for individuals and groups to protect themselves from those that would take their rights away from them. This can mean a (criminal) person trying to take your life, or a (tyrannical) government trying to take your liberty. This creates a balance of power between us and those that would harm us. Either way it is a balance between YOU, the individual, and EVERYONE ELSE that may try to take from you. Giving (and it is GIVING, because they do not have it, and CANNOT take it) the right to deprive us of our defense and therefore shift the balance of power in their favor to ANY of those groups or individuals on the other side of this equation is as dumb as giving it to any other group on that same side of the equation (keep in mind, you as an individual citizen are on the side opposing these groups, by definition).

Guns give power to the individual, whose right to Liberty is his own to protect, and without individual power, the entire concept of our government is undermined. As the joke goes, "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb discussing what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."


Summary:
Whether it's a government or a mugger in an alley trying to take from you that which you have a natural right to, you don't ask either one for permission to own or use the tools with which to fight back.

I love you.

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