Check it out, I know just the way to totally derail this argument, 100% success rate:

Y'know, I think there's another issue to be seen here, and I think this issue really is one of the underlying factors in this argument. So, let's address it, just get it out in the open. Cut, or uncut?

-I vote clean and cut all the way, it's hygenic, better looking, and reduces risk of cancer.

No way José, we did that fairly recently.

McLongName makes a strong case.

Well, I could say it's equally embarrassing to have to explain your own link to you but the fact is that it contains the following:

Title:

71% of Wisconsin Voters Say Gov. Walker's Budget Changes Are 'Fair'

Body:

The Franklin Center commissioned a poll of 500 likely voters in Wisconsin, which was conducted Feb. 21.

The results and specifics of the poll are listed below.
Governor Walker is asking unions to pay 5.8% of their salary toward the cost of their pensions plans and double their contributions for health care premiums to 12.6%. Is that fair?

71% Yes
22% No
7% Not sure

So the article contends that 71% think the budget changes are fair and then cites the poll question that specifies the "controversial" budget changes where respondents answered by 71% that they think they are fair. But, of course, you'll condescendingly disagree with me about the above facts so let's move on.

You also lied when you posted:



I thought Darth_Alran's response to you was well put:



You had already linked to a weak news piece that said the Madison Police Department was concerned. That article cites one sentence out of the excerpt that I quoted on the first page. Of course you could actually find the content in the phone call that supports your position. Well, you could if it existed.

Just the fact that Walker said that they "thought about it" regarding sending thugs into the peaceful protest is disgusting enough.

Also that Fox nation article (if you could call it that, the headline is almost as long as the body text that wasn't copied from elsewhere) is pretty misleading. They make it sound like 71% of the people approve of the whole budget bill. That's simply not the case and is easily verifiable by the link provided in their own article.

Again, I think Darth Alran's post was on point. He was being baited over and over. I would guess that, at worst, they might have talked about the idea of counter-protesters but ultimately decided against it for the reasons he stated. I find nothing disgusting in the conversation other than the portrayal of David Koch. That was pretty gross.



I think it was dumb for Jon`C to link to it to begin with. It's essentially Twitter on Fox Nation. It certainly wasn't any sort of mainstream article. Hell, I'd never even heard of Fox Nation before. Jon`C is trying to make it out to how you are trying to interpret it but, clearly, it does not say: 71% of people think Gov Walker's Budget Repair Bill is 'Fair'.

So what?

Entrapment is a legal defense to prevent police abuses. It doesn't mean you're innocent of hiring a prostitute just because she turns out to be a cop. A good person who believes in democracy could never be 'baited' into saying something so terrible, so heinous and treasonous against the principles his office stands for.

I'd be saying the same things if he were a democrat. How miserable that you only care about your own constitution when it is convenient for your own political party. Miserable and sad.

Yes it does.

Edit: Walker's proposed bill contains many components. The headline literally states that 71% approve of these changes. This is a lie, and using the approval rating of a single portion of the bill to justify your claim is fraudulent. You aren't nearly stupid enough to be unaware of this, which means you are intellectually dishonest.

The good news is that your children will probably become quite intelligent during their 'rebellious phase.' Maybe they'll amount to something in spite of your parental influence.

Yeah but this would be like your boss saying "hey you should hire a prostitute!" and you not wanting to offend your boss and getting fired reply "yeah, I thought about it, but I thinks that's more trouble than it's worth and here's why..."

Just replace Boss with campaign contributor and prostitute with placing "trouble makers"

Nah, "boss" works just fine.

I think the trouble here is that neither side sees what the other side is concerned about.

Public sector union opponents are concerned about unions providing a safe haven for employees that do poor work and impede the progress of diligent employee while receiving unfairly large paychecks that could be used to employ several worthwhile employees who need jobs. If you've worked in an organization with a union, chances are you've seen that this can be a real issue.

On the other hand, public union supporters do not want to hamstring the right of workers to ask for the best deal they can get. In a bad economy workers want to have a sense of job security that can be tough to get, and being diligent enough to guarantee this. This is also a non-trivial concern.

I think on the whole, it's important to remember that union workers get such a good deal, precisely because they are rare. If every low skill worker was in a union, that would definitly have a big impact on everyone else's standard of living. There isn't a magic bucket of "rich people money" that you can take. A look at big picture supply dynamics is helpful here.

No, actually it's just a bunch of rich ****s telling a group of people who make less than them that they make too much.

What? No, you're a liar. You're being intellectually dishonest. I'd call you a complete imbecile for posting this but I'd probably get banned, even though I wouldn't deserve it. If I had time I'd totally go through your entire post history and research all of the filthy lies you have said, but I don't have time because I'm too busy being a part-time janitor at some school or something?

The Tea Party is a grassroots movement, started by the average American and in support of the average American. That's why the Tea Party was started and organized by former Bush-era Republican power elites, supported by advocacy groups founded by the ultra-wealthy and financed by large foreign corporations, unofficially represented by an Arab-owned news corporation managed by a man who hates America, and exclusively supports a platform which benefits the richest 0.01% to the extreme detriment of all other Americans, the American way of life, the American economy and in general the future of America. Oh, and they're all fat white baby boomers, but that's okay because black people aren't Americans.

See? What more of this ***gy "proof" do you need?

How dare you post your lies. How dare you smear the Holy Elephant Idol. Praise be to the Glorious Lord Satan!

i dont think joncy meant to quote JM here.

i think.

Of course I meant to quote JM!

Unless I didn't, in which case I'm not wrong... it's just overoptimistic sports-like trash talking or some other incoherent garbage.

Haha, I'll drink to that.

Okay, so regarding the troll phone call you have alleged the following:





Yet you have not provided one single fact to support your allegations. In fact I am the one that has provided the best evidence you can possibly produce and it certainly doesn't substantiate your accusations. Now of course those here that worship at your altar or participate in the choir you preach to won't care much but the fair minded might see through your deceit.



My God, as llibja pointed out the thing can't even be considered an article. The content of the "piece" is a reflection of the title and is 100% accurate. The budget changes described were viewed favorably by 71%. Keep beating the horse if you want.



You're so cute when you take it to the gutter. A sign of intellectual maturity this sort of behavior is not. It's kind of like little glimpses into the real you.

No, I work part time delivering pizzas. I'm full time with the school district maintenance department which means I occasionally have to substitute for custodians when they are sick or whatever. I was a little disappointed at first, seeing as I have no interest in doing the work my military career would lead into, but I'm over that. Although my work might seem menial and degrading by you, I have an odd sense that I'm a happier and more satisfied person than you. Of course you would probably attribute that to my low intellect.

The work your military career would lead into?

Lying to kids, tricking them into killing themselves?

That doesn't seem like what a janitor is supposed to do.

I never lied to kids. It was also a different Army when I was a recruiter. I was done with that before we invaded Iraq. Oh, wait. I was supposed to be offended by your comments. Sorry to disappoint but keep trying. It makes you look superior!

"Look" superior, indeed.

It's less about Republican respect for women and more about the general risk of putting a woman on a national ticket. I'm not saying I agree with that sentiment, just that it exists. It would have been even more risky for the Democrats had they put Hillary at the top of the ticket. Democrats also lost by a far larger margin when they had a woman on the ticket back in '84.

Well, Mr. Superior, since I've given you plenty of time to explain yourself I guess I'll sum up where we are right now.

On the topic of Fox Nation I'll give you that the title could be slightly clearer. It could have been 71% of Wisconsin Voters believe [key or certain] budget changes are 'fair'. Given that I'll make that slight concession I would say, at best, your outright lie could be just an outright exaggeration.

On the topic of Gov. Walker's phone call you haven't offered any argument in your favor. Of course you haven't because your accusations are indefensible.

Now you have covered plenty of ground with regards to me but there's quite a bit left to address. I still need to lose a few pounds and my garage is a real mess. I have had a bit of a cold for the past several days too which probably points to some weakness in my constitution.