http://amconmag.com/12_15_03/feature.html

------------------
When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

I ****ing hate the US government. I heard about that awhile back shortly after it happened, but it still pisses me off.

So Flexor, if Bush is elected again, where's a good place in Canada to move to?

------------------
Frogblast the Vent Core!

--End of Line--

if i was one of the people being stuck in a "free speech zone" i would have a really loud PA system set up... of course one third of a mile is alot of distance even with a loud PA... so you would need a REALLY loud PA... then you would get in trouble because it would be so loud... but yeah that "free speech zone" BS is messed up

------------------
wang is within all

Big deal

------------------
Do you have stairs in your house?

uh, yeah Correction, it is a big deal. I can understand trying to protect the president, but this is just complete bull****. However, it might not have been the President's fault. The Secret Service actually do have some power to override his authority when it concerns his safety.

------------------
I am the god of dating! You will respect my authoritah!

[This message has been edited by Kieran Horn (edited January 17, 2004).]

That is stupid. I can see not allowing them within a certain distance of the president, because he IS the president. But designated zones for protest, where they are "quarentined"? Thats just rediculous.

This same thing used to happen to people who tried to talk to abortion clinic patients (well, except for the designated protest zones). Either way, it's still a violation of free speech.

I wanna know more about this "restricted area around the President" thing. Never heard of it before.

------------------
Nightmares run through my brain
Cold sweat covers me like a sickening stain
In this place between asleep and awake
I shake from the cold and the fear of heartbreak
And in the glow of the fire I turn into a liar
Too scared to say 'I know'
Like a sheperdless sheep I run and I weep
As I hear the cock crow
-3 Times Denied by 38th Parallel

Well, who upholds our rights?

Yay for free speech too.

Free speech has always been limited when dealing with the president. For example, you cannot talk about assassinating the president. Uh oh... whats that noise I hear at the door... justa sec guys....

------------------
Ω of 14
Half-Life 2 Central: your definitive source for everything HL2!

Originally, it was the state militias under the control of the state governors (it was just taken for granted that the Federal government would do stuff like this). That protection disappeared with the state sovereignty conflicts in the decades before the Civil War.

------------------
Nightmares run through my brain
Cold sweat covers me like a sickening stain
In this place between asleep and awake
I shake from the cold and the fear of heartbreak
And in the glow of the fire I turn into a liar
Too scared to say 'I know'
Like a sheperdless sheep I run and I weep
As I hear the cock crow
-3 Times Denied by 38th Parallel

Actually, I'm through protecting our president. politics as a whole: big deal :\
All that comes out of it is sensless bickering and finger-pointing. The reality of it is that it doesn't make a difference one way or another. my life (and your life) wouldn't be ANY different if bush was in office, if al gore was in office, if michael jordon was in office. Either way, nothing's going to be different, but one group is always going to have something to be upside about.

------------------
Do you have stairs in your house?

We only need to hear you once -- not 50 billion times -- to get your point. Please, spare us.

How on earth do any of you derive that Freedom of Speach guarantees you freedom from the consequences of that speach or the right to make that speach in areas where it impedes reasonably securing an area that the President will be in?

Also, Phoenix, I would suggest that anyplace in Canada might be a good place for you to move.

------------------
former TACC outcast

EH WRONG CORRECTION. If it was just them in office, yah, but Bush chooses his cabinet for the most part. They're the ones screwing us over, even if not Bush himself. If someone else was in charge, then there'd be a different cabinet, then...yatta. And about that "Who Upholds our Rights" comment, the police do. The Feds investigate big drug busts and the like, and the SS protect the president. They don't do jack for us, save keep a few hundred pounds of drugs off the street each year maybe. If Bush is elected into office again, I say a ratification of the Constitution is in order.

------------------
There is no signature

How does a simple sign disagreeing with Bush "impede securing an area"? It's not like they are carrying AK-47s here. If the signs themselves (somehow) were seen as a physical threat then why were the pro bush signs not also moved?

If this was all about security the media would have been able to talk to the people in these "free speech" zones.

------------------
Cantina Cloud | BCF | The Massassian 1 & 2 | Gonkmeg
Corrupting the kiddies since '97

Thank you Jaiph

------------------
There is no signature

This has been going on for years.

------------------
I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

It seems like people get all pissed off when they hear the name "Bush." If it were any other president Im sure you wouldnt bother to post it at massassi

------------------
nil nip nada zip zero naught lip zil

Maybe the fact that only signs that support Bush are allowed in his view? I mean, it almost makes me think Bush is oblivious to the fact that some people don't like me, and Ashcroft is trying to reinforce that oblivion.

But don't blame me. We tried to keep Ashcroft out of the government. We just didn't think anyone would be brazen or stupid enough to put him at the federal level.

------------------
"LC Tusken: the idiot is the person who follows the idiot and your not following me your insulting me your following the path of a idiot so that makes you the idiot"
NMGOH || Jack Chick preaches it || The Link of the Dead

If you're trying to get away from political messes, you might wanna stay away from quebec.


------------------
When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

Very well said, I couldn't have said it better!

YAY Toronto! AHH SARS! /me runs to Vancover...ahh that's better................What?

------------------
Gondor has no pants.
Gondor needs no pants.

And brad was never heard of again.



------------------
When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

You're just saying that because you aren't old enough yet to pay taxes, and not old enough to try and hold a real job.

------------------
Snail racing: (500 posts per line)
-------------@%

DSettahr's Homepage

It was just the UPS guy... The assassin was in the shower.

------------------
Gondor has no pants.
Gondor needs no pants.

Congradulations, you just discovered the 5th branch of the US government.



So, let's get this straight, your implying that anything that does not support our government is wrong? If we followed your line of reasoning we'd still be british colonies.

"When any form of government becomes destructive in securing the rights of the governed, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it."-Declaration of Independance

http://www.badnarik.org/issues/government_and_constitution.html



Same 200+ old BS argument. Again, if we followed your line of reasoning we'd still be British colonies.

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edumund Burke, Irish Philospher, Statesman



Unfortunately, this is less politics as it is a part of the more permainant government agencies. The CIA, SS, FBI, and many other agencies gain more control to do what they want to do with presidential administrations as we are seeing with the current Bush Administration.



To be fair, in some cases ALL sign carriers (even the PRO ones) were ordered to be out of view. It is still flawed reasoning to believe that this could possibly deter terroism. The ironic part is that they know this. This isn't even about terrorism. This is about preventing negative press. Specifically speaking, this is about preventing negative press about both the Bush Administration and the whole "War on Terroism" concept.

Ironically, the whole concept of a war on terroism is ridiculous. You cannot fight a faceless enemy. If for nothing else, the general rule is for each terroist you take out, two more will take their place. However, what we're seeing happend is a huge "Scare Tactic" by the US. Sadly, it's working. But it won't work forever. The world will become tired of being surpressed. They will unite together in a way no one ever imagined and rebel against the governments that attempted to control them with a 3in leash. The war will last for decades, resulting in grate loss of life. No one will be untouched by the death and destruction that will result. But in the end, the people of the world will be victorious. A new "world" government will be formed. One with better checks and balances.

In short, the short comming of our government is actually a good thing as long as we can recognize and learn from those errors.

/end rant

------------------
"At last, we have come to find the truth to our souls. Though, the truth is not what we expected. I now fear my own soul."

[This message has been edited by CaptBewil (edited January 17, 2004).]

"Again, if we followed your line of reasoning we'd still be British colonies."

and? Is Bush much better?

------------------
Gondor has no pants.
Gondor needs no pants.

... Any respect I may have had for you has now been lost. Congratulations.

------------------
Moo.

alaska shouldd be safe.
if this goes too far, california might decide to seceede(sp?)

------------------
your curiosity will get the better of YOU one day.
Jon`C:Irony is spelling 'quality' poorly.
Spork:Well I think 'Irony is spelling grammar poorly'
Snail racing: (500 posts per line)-@%

maybe it distracts the newer agents and makes them hate bush and quit their jobs, thereby makeing the area taking longer to secure.

I think...

------------------
your curiosity will get the better of YOU one day.
Jon`C:Irony is spelling 'quality' poorly.
Spork:Well I think 'Irony is spelling grammar poorly'
Snail racing: (500 posts per line)-@%

brad, who is this brad. there is no brad here. what, there is definatly no osiris either. what on earth are you talking about.



------------------
your curiosity will get the better of YOU one day.
Jon`C:Irony is spelling 'quality' poorly.
Spork:Well I think 'Irony is spelling grammar poorly'
Snail racing: (500 posts per line)-@%

"The police cleared the path of the motorcade of all critical signs, though folks with pro-Bush signs were permitted to line the president’s path."

It's in the article. Like I said, it almost seems possible that Ashcroft is trying to reinforce Bush's oblivion to opposition.

Note: nothing against Bush, but I despise Ashcroft with a seething passion. The guy wants a police state, and he's trying to get it under the guise of "securing democracy."



That's a tad apocalyptic, there. Of course, it's about as likely to happen as a free, happy, and secure Iraq and Afghanistan, and that's also a tad utopic.

------------------
"LC Tusken: the idiot is the person who follows the idiot and your not following me your insulting me your following the path of a idiot so that makes you the idiot"
NMGOH || Jack Chick preaches it || The Link of the Dead

[This message has been edited by Wolfy (edited January 18, 2004).]

Look, the exact same thing happens regardless of who the president is or what party the president belongs too.

------------------
I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

Doesn't make it right.

------------------
When bread becomes toast, it can never go back to being bread again.

No but it does mean that.. *GASP* Bush isn't the be-all end-all source and incarnation of all evil flaws and infractions of politics rights and humanities ever..

Probably every adolescent art-major protestor and complainer about fnord ever has been echoed in every generation about every politician about every government dating all the way back to Urkog the Mesopotamian chieftain before they invented agriculture. At the very least i'm certain you can find virtually identical statements and sentiments expressed in Rome and such by youth or whatever. Or for informed people with intellect or whatever. Doesn't make it necessarily any more right or wrong, just don't pretend and purport that it's some new age of evil incarnate.



Fnord --^

------------------
[Blue Mink Bifocals !] [fsck -Rf /world/usr/] [<!-- kalimonster -->] [Capite Terram]
Applecore scowled. "What does that mean, 'real'? Amn't I real, you? If you cut me, do I not bleed? If you piss me off, will I not kick you up the arse?" -War of the Flowers
NPC.Interact::PressButton($'Submit');

[This message has been edited by Dormouse (edited January 18, 2004).]

which was exactly my point, thank you.



Read the rest of the article...I was just being fair by presenting everything. Not that that point even matters in the larger scheme of things.



All politicians are hungry for power. That's now what we have to be concered ourselves with at the moment. That's simply a fact we can't do anything with. Right now, we have to take advantage of any politician who supports our views. We can deal with them later...



Sometimes prophicies come true, not because they are truly visionary, but because people want them to occur. If the passion and desire are there, the rest will ussually fall into place.

------------------
"At last, we have come to find the truth to our souls. Though, the truth is not what we expected. I now fear my own soul."

Actually, I implied nothing of the sort. It's just obvious that some people feel that Freedom of Speech means freedom from any negative consequences of that speech. Seperate is the issue that any of these protesters speech was abridged. They were more than capable of holding their protests where ever else they wanted so that it wouldn't be subject to having to be put in a designated area. To me it doesn't matter who the president is, the site needs to be secure.

And I love it when people try to criticize conservatives with conservative quotes. I wholeheartedly agree with both of the quotes you used in response to me. I just don't see how they conflict with anything I said.


------------------
former TACC outcast

anyone notice this?:
The Secret Service is duty-bound to protect the president. But it is ludicrous to presume that would-be terrorists are lunkheaded enough to carry anti-Bush signs when carrying pro-Bush signs would give them much closer access. And even a policy of removing all people carrying signs—as has happened in some demonstrations—is pointless, since potential attackers would simply avoid carrying signs. Presuming that terrorists are as unimaginative and predictable as the average federal bureaucrat is not a recipe for presidential longevity.

Go, stupid terrorists!

------------------
<Genki> oh, where are you going, with beards all a waggin, no knowin no knowin what bring dear Mr. Baggins, and Balin, and Dwalin, here down in the vally Ah ha!

BUSH SOLD HIS SOUL TO THE DEVIL TO GET ELECTED AND HES GOING 2 SHEWT NUKLAR MIZZELS AT EVERYWUN AND KILL US ALL AND HES A DEMONIC DICTATOR AND HES LIEK HITELR OMFG IM MOVING 2 KANADA DEWD

OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG

WE SHULD ALL LIEK GO AND REVOLT U NO LOL!!1111







------------------
"In the memory you'll find me. Eyes burning up.
The darkness holding me tightly.
Untill the sun rises up."

I'm getting sick of this, many 'teens' have been brainwashed to belive democratic things, Now I'm not saying "OMFG GO CONSERVITIVEE111" All I'm saying is decide for yourselfs damnit.


Study up on what the democrats have done, what they say they'll do, and who they are.

Likewise, study up on the other sides rather then just beliving what everyone else says or writes.

Remmber one thing about politians: Actions speak louder then words.


And for the love of god, Bush is not satan himself, hes not the best president ever, far from it. but NOONE is perfect.

I don't mind complaining about the current power, but its this constant whining like "omg im moving 2 canada dewd" or "BUSH IS HITLER OMG" Why can't you just go "Hmm, I dissagree with his blah blah policy" or "In my opinion, this is a bad idea that blah blah blah came up with" many of you have been doing that, but a few have been making really dumbass statements.


Just. Stop. it.

Complain, state your opinion, but don't be a jackass about it!


And that goes for everyone, conservitive or not, its not black and white anymore, its 32-bit

------------------
"In the memory you'll find me. Eyes burning up.
The darkness holding me tightly.
Untill the sun rises up."

[This message has been edited by Oberfeldwebell (edited January 18, 2004).]