http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/West/02/14/samesex.marriage/index.html

I don't believe this has been allowed before...but this is the first time I'm aware of such licenses actually being given legally in the US. [prediction/opinion] this is where the downfall of the US starts [/prediction/opinion]

To comment randomly, as I'm extremely tired, today at work two kids about 10 years old came up saying "every little bit helps!" holding up a napkin saying "Heading to San Fransisco" and below it "Gay." They were looking at us, one girl asked "are you guys really...?" they both nodded.

I live in Orange County, halfway between LA and San Diego, in California. I don't really want to know what their orientation was or if they were trying to make an extra buck or what, but this serious stuff...

Unless I'm mistaken, this is the first time this has been happening. I'm like in shock that it's happening.

The cover of the LA times for Friday the 13th was two old women, at LEAST 60 by the look of it, crying/smiling with their heads leaning on each other's foreheads. I was at 7-11 at 2:00 AM and I was like "Hey, I haven't read the times in like 2 months, I should grab a copy while I'm here. I saw that picture and immediately felt grossed out, continuing my hot chocolate run. I'll grab a copy another day.

What do you guys think about this whole deal?

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I'm going to go out and do stuff, like besides work. Call up ben, hang out. Maybe see the last samurai, go skydiving, whatever.
Get back into the gym...
I want to do stuff that prevents me from playin video games so I can only play them a few hours a day, basically.
(Formally Veger, who died when he lost his e-mail adress, and his password. Veeger still looks for his old pass...)

[This message has been edited by Veeger (edited February 14, 2004).]

I'm for gay marriage. Marriage is a sign of love between two people. If they love each other, they should have every right to get married. who are you to say different? They aren't hurting you in anyway. Hell, they're helping you if anything. More gay men = more lonely ladies.

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My Daily Ramblings
"This world is made of love and peace!"
"Let's live today, let's live tomorrow, and let's live the day after that, even if it means living in eternal pain."
- Vash the Stampede

I'm not really against it... But there is just something thats always been in the back of my head that says its wrong to have gay marriages.

One other thing... how come when gay men walk in a gay pride parade in a thong, they are being "courageous", but when women do it in a beer commercial or something, they are being "slutty"?

That reminds me, a few people at work and I had an idea that we are going to throw a "straight pride" parade. Anyone else want in on it?

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"Guns don't kill people, I kill people."

if you are grossed out and offended by homosexuals then expect to be offended and grossed out alot during your life...

and remember WE ARE ALL GAY the question to ask yourself is "how gay am i?"

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wang is within all

There is somewhat of a paradox with "gay issues".

If someone is "for" gay rights, it probably means they arent very religious, 'cus most religions seem to find gayness morally wrong.

So if they aren't religious, then they basically believe that people were put on Earth for one reason: To make more people.

So if the only reason they are here is to reproduce and eventually die, then there must be something wrong with gay people, because they aren't reproducing.

However, if people do think there is more to life than reproduction, and dont think theres anything wrong with gays, then they are likely to be religious... which views gayness as morally wrong.

If what I just said doesn't make sense to you, then you're a better person than I, and you dont need to rub it in.

What I'm basically saying is, sensitivity be damned, there IS something psychologically wrong with gay people, because people are supposed to be attracted to the opposite sex so that they can make more people.

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"Guns don't kill people, I kill people."

I don't have a problem with it at all and I don't thin it's any government's place to tell people what a marriage is.

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I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

Avenger: Here here.

As to the post above that, I'm neither religious, or of the belief that procreation is a way of life, I believe there to be nothing "wrong" with gay people at all - in fact, one of my best friends is [and no, he doesn't try to grab people's asses or whatever, he just goes out with other lads].

I can't see why homophobia isn't as sensitive an issue as racism - I know it's a terrible analogy, but banning black/white weddings would cause uproar - so why should anyone ban man/man woman/woman weddings?

I don't want to rant, I just find it hard to accept that people still find gay people repulsive or whatever - they're just people!

(ducks)

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If at first you don't succeed, lower your standards.

Wrong forum...

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The future is here, and all bets are off.

Here's how I think about it:

Regardless of whether or not gay and lesbian marriages is morally right or wrong, it should be allowed. If gays and lesbians are allowed to marry, they are not interfering with the lifestyles of straight people. However, by banning gay and lesbian marriages, straight people are interfering with the lifestyles of non-straight people.

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And everything under the sun is in tune, but the sun is eclipsed by the moon...

DSettahr's Homepage

i was watching a TV magizne show on that night, and 2 clergy men were argueing about this issue.

on had the stance: gay marrages will be of 2 people that love eachother, and the other side must see the fact that these are leagally binding things and are keeping gays from forming coomunities in there own right. Also, what was the harm in it?, this forces them to stay in a more perminate relationship.

the other made the point: The roots of marrage come from God concercrating a untion between man and women, yes, give gays civil unions, but marrage was and is only intended for a man and woman. basically~ because of the religous aspects and orgin, gays should not be allowed.

it botherd me how thay called strate marrages:hetrosexual marrage and gay marrages:gay marrage.... if there going to use a tecknical name for one, thay should use a trcknical name for both.

I think that because of the goverment's involvement in the process, and every aspect of it's taxcuts, programs, and tons of things for married people, that gay unions are not elligable for, that the laws should be changed for the gay right's movement.

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IMPORTANT NOTICE PLEASE READ

Employees dying on the job are faling to fall down. THIS PRACTICE MUST STOP as it becmes impossible to distinguish between death and the natural movement of he staf.

Any employee found dead in an upright position will be dropped from the payroll.

Wrong... just wrong.

And you say those kids were only 10 years old? That is REALLY WRONG!

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I believe that homosexuality is wrong, purely on religious grounds. Should this issue come to vote, I will vote against it. Maybe it will be legalized. If it is, then no biggie. I put my vote in, but the majority disagreed with me - democracy at work.

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"LC Tusken: the idiot is the person who follows the idiot and your not following me your insulting me your following the path of a idiot so that makes you the idiot"
NMGOH || Jack Chick preaches it || The Link of the Dead

I'm perfectly fine with them getting married. Our rights stop where they start interfering with their rights.

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"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

"Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right." -Isaac Asimov

Sorry, but to put it bluntly, I am, and always will be an anti-gay.

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Member of the Minneassian Council

I'm against gay marriage, but not for religious reasons, since I'm not very religious. I just think it is wrong. I know it's not their fault and they didn't choose to be gay, but I still don't have to like it.

People who I've debated this with say that whether or not they're married, gay couples will exist. True, but it's not official. Marriage is official. If we allow gay marriage, it's like we're saying it's perfectly normal, when it is not at all.

Another thing I don't agree with is gay couples adopting children. I know it helps because there are millions of orphaned children, but think of what the child will go through. I know he/she won't be turned gay or anything, but it will not be a normal childhood, growing up with two mothers or two fathers. Plus, imagine the brutal teasing the child will get at school if any kids find out.

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Kids must be shot by Monday.

Honesty tests for workers can't be trusted, report says.

Psychopaths are unpredictable.

Jay Leno's Headlines > Everything

They just want equal rights- that's all. The United States has laws pertaining to marriage, and gives benefits to couples who are married. If we truly had the separation of church and state like we're supposed to, gay couples wouldn't be forced to "corrupt" the "sanctity" of marriage.

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Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.

[This message has been edited by CygnusX (edited February 15, 2004).]

Two men can't have children.

One man and one woman can.

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Home is behind, the world ahead, and there are many paths to tread. Through shadow, to the edge of night, until the stars are all alight. Mist and shadow, cloud and shade, all shall fade, all shall fade.

What DSettahr said.

Polls have shown the majority of the country is for civil unions but against marriage for gay couples. The obvious solution is for the government to call all marriages civil unions to avoid the stupid semantics arguements. People can get married in the religious building of their choice and/or drop by the courthouse to get the legal papers.

One women on her own can have children too, one man on his own: not so much.

Thus if anything we should be banning males because theyve become superfluous in reproduction.

This topic has come up myriad times of late with people i know, so i'll just dig up bits i've already said:





-Administrative reasons to pass it: to try to cull a handful more votes.
-Administrative reasons not to pass it: No economic advantage if it won't encourage them to procreate more and indoctrinate their spawn into capitalism.

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[Blue Mink Bifocals !] [fsck -Rf /world/usr/] [<!-- kalimonster -->] [Capite Terram]
"You'll have to face it, the endings are the same however you slice it. Don't be deluded by any other endings, they're all fake, with malicious intent to deceive, or just motivated by excessive optimism if not by downright sentimentality. The only authentic ending is the one provided here: John and Mary die. John and Mary die. John and Mary die." -Happy Endings [Margeret Atwood]
NPC.Interact::PressButton($'Submit');

[This message has been edited by Dormouse (edited February 15, 2004).]

Artificial insemination is not an option. That rod fits in that hole for a reason.

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Home is behind, the world ahead, and there are many paths to tread. Through shadow, to the edge of night, until the stars are all alight. Mist and shadow, cloud and shade, all shall fade, all shall fade.

But it also fits there whether you are married or not

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I hate kids.

It's appalling that there are so many people wanting to ban something that will make the lives of thousands much happier and will degrade their own not a whit.

I don't like chocolate ice cream but I understand that some (exceedingly sick and deranged! ) people get something positive out of it. Who am I to tell them they're wrong?

Next you'll be telling me that sucking termites out of a termite mound with a vaccuum cleaner is immoral because youre supposed to put a stick in there for them to climb onto then lick the termites off the stick.. and don't even get started on ant farms..

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[Blue Mink Bifocals !] [fsck -Rf /world/usr/] [<!-- kalimonster -->] [Capite Terram]
"You'll have to face it, the endings are the same however you slice it. Don't be deluded by any other endings, they're all fake, with malicious intent to deceive, or just motivated by excessive optimism if not by downright sentimentality. The only authentic ending is the one provided here: John and Mary die. John and Mary die. John and Mary die." -Happy Endings [Margeret Atwood]
NPC.Interact::PressButton($'Submit');

I would just like to say one thing: history has shown that things like this will almost always result in an expansion of rights, and the eventual acceptance of whatever is being contested. Or does everybody here forget the civil rights movement 40 years ago? Or giving women the right to vote? Or slavery? In every case there were morality arguments, religious arguments, and many more against the expansion of civil rights, and in every case it happened regardless. In about 5 years I fully expect all states to have gay marriages allowed. It might take another million man/woman march, but it will happen.

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"What sane person could live in this world, and *not* be crazy?"

Council of 14

"I am the signature virus! Copy me into your signature so that I can take over the world! Moohahahee!"

[This message has been edited by KyleKatarn7 (edited February 15, 2004).]

Thats just dumb.

You show me one woman who can make a baby without sperm produced by a male, and I'll go back into hiding.

There is such a thing called "donors", and if males were "banned", then the supply would eventually run out.


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"Guns don't kill people, I kill people."

Why are some of you crying over this? It doesn't affect you at all. No noes! Gay people can marry, end of the world! Everyones going to go gay!

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Massassian since: March 12, 2001

[=-"The hardest thing is to forgive, but God does;
Even if you murdered or robbed, years wrong, but God loves;
Take one step toward him, he takes two toward you;
Even when all else fail, God supports you." - Nas-=]

I dont agree with same-sex marriages at all. And those gay 10 year olds, that is absolutly sick. At that age they would have no idea what there sexual preference is! I mean for ****s sake they havent gone through puberty yet, they shouldn't really be attracted to either girls or boys yet! They are in grade 5!

Interesting to see how the anti-gay arguments are devoid of any logic.

Really, how in the name of anything will it affect anyone? Someone give me an answer, otherwise, you are all just spewing nonsense.

You know, as much as I hate political correctness, but these comments irk me, especially Monoxide. Let's put another word in there, how about black, jew, ect ect, you get the deal. Did some gay guy try to pick up on you or something?

While it is natural disgust, I don't see why people bother getting angry. People have lots of problems. I hate relegion and see it as a festering cancer that needs to be exterminated as quickly as possible. Doesn't mean I hate the people practicing any relegion, just the institutions themselves. But truly, if there was an act to vote on banning relegion, I would be against it, because it is interfereing with other's freedom. Hell, relegion to me is more offensive on the lives of others than being gay, yet I don't see any movement to prevent worship.

I'm using relegion because it is a common trait, so maybe you anti-gays can see it from the other side. Imagine if you had your freedoms taken away. You say being gay isn't natural, allright, relegion isn't either. Why don't we digress into animals again, just so we are all natural again, allright? Oh, an irony is that some animals can be "gay", but I think more or less it's a lack of prefrence and more like bi-sexulality. So indeed, having gay relations is indeed more natrual than relegion...

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http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99993815

http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99993700

http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99993688

Now admittedly it is extremely new technology and they haven't as yet [that i know of] created embryos that will develop into children, but when they can make their own eggs and sperms it won't be long at all.

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[Blue Mink Bifocals !] [fsck -Rf /world/usr/] [<!-- kalimonster -->] [Capite Terram]
"You'll have to face it, the endings are the same however you slice it. Don't be deluded by any other endings, they're all fake, with malicious intent to deceive, or just motivated by excessive optimism if not by downright sentimentality. The only authentic ending is the one provided here: John and Mary die. John and Mary die. John and Mary die." -Happy Endings [Margeret Atwood]
NPC.Interact::PressButton($'Submit');

[This message has been edited by Dormouse (edited February 15, 2004).]

There's too much ignorance and bigotry on this thread to tackle all of, so I'll address a few points.



So, by that logic, there's something wrong with me, because I choose not to have children. Also, my aunt is infertile, so, thus, something is wrong(psychologically speaking) with her.

Shall we just round up all the homosexuals, infertile women, sterile men and those who choose not to have children and blast them into the sun? They're not benefitting the human race, so why not?



As this is your opinion, and nothing more, I can't argue against it. I can, however, offer mine: Your opinion is bigoted and, frankly, quite disgusting.



...but, wait, aren't you the big ol' adovcate on these forums for smoking pot? What makes that a-okay and gay marriage wrong?
Methinks something is amiss...



Raoul, I recommend an anthropology course for your ethnocentrism. American society has one of the more conservative cultures in the world with regard to children and sex.

[This message has been edited by Yossarian (edited February 15, 2004).]

Not all of us were ignorant little ******** when we were 10. In fact, way back in kindergarten I had a 'girlfriend'. I didn't discriminate at all until I started having out with a group of very poor influences.

It's the whole "girls are yucky!" BS that gets passed on to us at an early age, by proxy through kids who have parents that are totally neurotic about their children having sex when they're young.

Exactly the same kind of exposure is what convinces us that homosexuality is wrong. No matter how you think you can justify it, it's bigotry. After all, the Nazis sincerely believed the Jews were stealing all of their jobs, money, women, and land didn't they?

In short, all of the bigots on this thread: I'll be charging you for the damages to my room after 50 tons of industrial-grade idiocy firehosed out of my monitor. Expect a bill.

There are loads of holes you can fit it into...

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Sweet irony...

People complain about it because they don't realize that religion and faith have nothing to do with politics. The people who generally are against this (somebody is sure to say "nuh-uh" to this, but I said generally) are the people who vote Republican because it's the party with the strongest tie to Christianity.

I want to say something that came to mind right now. Until Christianity came along, gays were actually rather common among the world. Many Romans were homosexual, and guess what!? They killed Christ. So perhaps that's some deep rooted reason why in the Christian faith Gays are apalling.

At any rate, people want to outlaw gay marriage because they think that marriage only holds a sacred bond, and a gay marriage goes against their religious/moral beliefs and somehow, those two people being happy with one-another are going to destroy the sacred bond that they intend to achieve/already have. It's ridiculous.

Marriage is a contract. A legally binding statement that says that one person and another person are going to be the pair of people forever. This contract is, however, negotiable, and can be withdrawn from through divorce. I bet you see less homosexual divorces that you'll ever see of heterosexual divorces.

Everybody needs to just quit acting like the kook in the Upper City of Taris in KotOR, ranting and raving about the aliens being the downfall of the planet. [/rant]

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-=I'm the wang of this here site, and it's HUGE! So just imagine how big I am.=-
1337Yectiwan
OSC Returns!!
10 of 14 -- 27 Lives On

My views: I am not gay and will never be gay. I do not enjoy watching gays make out, etc. I also realize that there is nothing wrong in being gay in and of itself. I realize that most gays aren't some of these fruits you see on TV or butch lesbians. Most of them are normal people and you wouldn't be able to tell them from any other person. If you see a gay being a push over about his homosexuality and smashing it in your face, realize that being gay doesnt cause him to be that way, being an *** causes him to be that way. I know that gays are going to live together no matter what. Making it legal only gives them tax benefits and affects the census.

You do not have to accept homosexuality. But you do need to tolerate it, otherwise you are no better than Strom Thurgood(is that his name?).

Just to make a note: There is a movement to ban gay marriages. Bush is pushing an amendment to ban them, and that will take the power of the states to regulate marriage within their own boundries away from them.

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Checksum: I thought about it, I guess I'm striving for my own personal ideals. I'll just project those ideals onto Jesus and say "I'm trying to be like Jesus" so that I won't have to listen to you banter endlessly about me worshipping a false god or some such.

The Last True Evil: Ironically, that's very Christian of you.

Also, if gay marriages are legal in a state, that doesn't mean that churches have to marry them. They can still refuse to marry them. Gays will have to get married in a court or on a ship.

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Checksum: I thought about it, I guess I'm striving for my own personal ideals. I'll just project those ideals onto Jesus and say "I'm trying to be like Jesus" so that I won't have to listen to you banter endlessly about me worshipping a false god or some such.

The Last True Evil: Ironically, that's very Christian of you.

[This message has been edited by Kieran Horn (edited February 15, 2004).]

Which is the it probably is going to be.

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I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

People say it doesn't affect other people, but in reality it does. Unless we ship the married gays off to some isolated island, it will affect other people. So stop pretending it wont.

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Ω of 14

How does the piece of paper saying they are married affect you?

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Of war, we don't speak anymore

HOW Brad? How in the world is it going to affect you? The only way it's going to affect you is if in your mind you constantly sit mulling over the fact that you think that it's wrong. They're not physically doing anything to you. Chances are, since you're in such disregard for the practice you'll never even know a married gay couple, because you choose not to associate with them. So explain to me, using something other than your morals, your faith, and your stagnent outlook on life how it's going to affect you or anybody else. Because I don't believe you, because I know you're wrong because you're always the stick in the mud when it comes to anything leftist.

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-=I'm the wang of this here site, and it's HUGE! So just imagine how big I am.=-
1337Yectiwan
OSC Returns!!
10 of 14 -- 27 Lives On

You can't argue that homosexuality itself is not wrong. Men and women are supposed to be attracted to each other so that they may mate, and continue the species. If men-men and woman-woman couples were okay, then surely there'd be some natural and/or evolutional grounds for the species to deal with it. Obviously this theory can't exactly be tested, proven or at all supported, due to the fact that our population is extreemly large, and I'm pretty sure it's well under even a quarter of our total population that is homosexual. (That is born homosexuals, not "gay because I wanted a change", or "I just though I'd try it out", or "I had a bad relationship, I though I'd try the other team" etc..)

I think you have to see the difference between the two. Some people are admittedly born attracted to their own sex, and some do just do it because of whatever reason that makes them want to change or can be attracted to both, but just prefer one.

There has to be something fundamentaly wrong with it, or there'd be some evidence to support it in nature. Unless you want to say that this is some bizzare evolutionary method to cull our own species. But I couldn't understand how that would work... How would a "born gay" know the species needed a cut down before they were born and educated? Why would their brain make them attracted to the wrong sex instead of making them impotent, unfertile, or just not attracted to anything? Why would a species *want* to kill itself (or part of) off? Unless we each have some deep subconscious or instinctive knowledge of what the possiblities and effects of an over-population can have on the environment (e.g. food supply).


Socially, however, I don't have a problem with gay marriages or gay relationships.

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"When all else fails, eat pie."
-¬thoughts from beyond observance

[This message has been edited by Jin (edited February 15, 2004).]