Heh. Well, I don`t exactly claim to write in 100% pure english. Insofar, I`m not breaking anything, that would incur information loss... And as for comas, I tend to use more... Computerised, I`d say, view of grammar, as computer generally has no intention to understand wankiness.

As for ` - well, I`m just used to it. Reaching for ' is quite awkward for me, as I`m used to type apostrophe with left hand, and not right.

Russian has own problems, yes... For example, different endings for same word to specify various conditions. For example, in "I, Alice." and "To Alice.", word Alice would have different endings. It seems to be very baffling at first, but one would notice, that Russian is much more rule-structurised, then English. For example, I had awful troubles learning the "incorrect verbs" - we have no such thing at all. Articles are another thing I simply fail to see the usefulness in.

I have to wonder if you're my long lost sibling who spent years with me and knows how I usually behave. ("for a change", even?) Just because I don't take anyone's word for granted if they have no evidence to back them up, does not mean that I am not smart. In fact, quite the contrary.

Really, not to be a b**** or anything, but talk to an English teacher about it. I can understand not taking random internet people at their word, but talk to someone who would know.

"Use a comma before a coordinating conjunction joining independent clauses.

There are seven coordinating conjunctions in English: and, but, or, yet, so, for and nor. A comma tells the reader that one independnt clause has come to a close and that another is about to begin."

Independent clause = something that can stand on its own. When you're using a comma to seperate two independent clauses, you need a conjunction.

"Use a comma after an introductory clause or phrase.

A comma tells readers that the introductory clause or phrase has come to a close and that the main part of the sentence is about to begin.

Use a comme between all items in a series"

ie listing things such as saying "I need to pick up pasta, meat, toilet paper and yogurt"

"Use a comma between coordinate adjectives not joined with and. Do not use a comma between cumulative adjectives.

Roberto is a warm, gentle, affectionate father
but
Three large gray shapes moved slowly toward us."

"Use commas to set off nonrestrictive elements. Do not use commas to set off restrictive elements.

Restrictive element: defines or limits the meaning of the word it modifiesand is therefore essential to the meaning of the sentence

Restrictive: For the camp the children need clothes that are washable

nonrestrictive element: describes a noun or pronoun whose meaning has already been clearly defined or llimited

nonrestrictive: For the camp the children need sturdy shoes, which are expensive"

how I always understood that is say Tony has 4 brothers. You don't need a comma because it would not be clear which one you're talking about. "Tony's brother John" but if he only had one brother, the name is superfluous. "Tony's brother, John"

"Adjective clauses

Nonrestrictive clause: use commas
"Ed's house, which is located on thirteen acres, was completely furnished..."

Restrictive Clause:
"Ramona's cat that just had kittens became defensive around the other cats in the house."
Because the adjective clause that just had kittens identifies the particular cat, the information is essential."

"Phrases functioning as adjectives

nonrestrictive phrase:
The helicopter, with its million-candlepower spotlight illuminting the area, circled above.
The with phrase is nonessential because its purpose is not to specify which of the two or more helicopters is being discussed.

Restrictive phrase:
One corner of the attic was filled with newspapers dating from the urn of the century.
Dating from the turn of the century restricts the meaning of newspapers, so the comma should be omitted.

Appositives

Nonrestrictive Appositive
Darwin's most important book, On the Origin of Species, was the result of many years of research.
[/i]Most important[/i] restricts the meaning to one book, so the appositive On the Origin of Species is nonrestrictive.

Restrictive
The song "Vertigo" was blasted out of huge amplifiers at the concert
Once they've read song, readers still don't know precisely which song the writer means.

Use commas to set off transitional and parenthetical expressions, absolute phrases, and elements expressing contrast.

Transitional Expressions:
adverbs such as however, therefore and moreover.

Minh did not understand our language; moreover, he was unfamiliar with our customs.

As a matter of fact, American football was established by fans who wanted to play a more organized game of rugby.
Natural foods are not always salt free; celery, for example, contains more sodium than most people would imagine.

Parenthetical
-Providing supplemental information, they interrupt the flow of a sentence or appear at the end as afterthoughts.

Evolution, as far as we know, doesn't work this way.
The bass weighed about twelve pounds, give or take a few ounces.

Absulute phrases - modifies the whole sentence

The sun appearing for the first time in a week, we were at last able to begin the archaeological dig.
Elvis Presley made music industry history in the 1950's, his records having sold more then ten million copies.

Do not inster a comma between the noun and participle in an absulute construction.
The next contestant (no comma) being five years old, the emcee adjusted the height of the microphone.

Contrasted elements

The epicurean philosophers sought mental, not bodily, pleasures.
Unlike Robert, Celia loved dance contests.

Use commas to set off nouns of direct address, the words yes and no, interrogative tags, and mild interjections.

Forgive us, Dr Atkins, for having rolls with dinner tonight.
Yes, the loan will probably be approved.
The film was faithful to the book, wasn't it?
Well, cases like these are difficult to decide

Use commas with experssions such as he said to set off direct quotations.

Naturalist Arthur Cleveland Bent remarked, "In part the peregrine declined unnoticed because it is not adorable."
"Convictions are more dangerous foes of truth than lies," wrote philosopher Friedrich Nietzche."

Use commas to prevent confusion.

"To err is human; to forgive, divine.

if two words in a row echo each other, a comma may be needed for ease of reading.
All of the catastrophes that was had feared might happen, happened.

Sometimes a comma is needed to prevent readers from grouping words in ways that do not match the writer's intention.
Patients who can, walk up and down the halls several times a day."

Basically, you're useing commas several times in the middle of every phrase, which is rarely supposed to happen, and the "use a comma where you would pause" rule ispretty unreliable. EVen if we did use that rule, if you paused every time you used a comma, you would sound like you're gasping for breath.

I'm aware that I just spent way too much of my friday night on that. The source is the newest version of the bedford handbook, and I just realized that the next section would be more appropriate: inappropriate use of commas, but screw that. I already spent a pathetic amount of time on this.

Jesus ****ing christ. Alice Shade posted 110 times in one day.

You should put all that effort into something less wordy and more worthwhile, like rewriting the Bible in hieroglyphics.

Christ, he's right. Look at that.

We have plenty of people who have been here longer than seven years and still don't have that many posts.

Ohh I get it now. She's the newest version of the ALICE bot.

Good guess, but try again.

On a side note, alone on a slow rainy Saturday, there`s not much else to do.

I`ll definitely be less wordy throughout the workweek.

Gotta love my rommie...she has nothing else better to do but copy for my bedford handbook. Meh, it was my idea for her to do it.
But anyway, I have issues with commas but that is rediculous; and I'm not even a grammer nazi....

Oh? I don`t put them in silly places, you know.

I put them where they should be. English often "smooths" off extra comas, where they are entirely warranted, logically.

o rly?

Y, rly.

Maybe this quote looks weird to you, but I find this separation to be logical.

That's fine, but I suspect that only one of us has been paid money to fix other people's English writing. That quote does not just look weird to me, it looks weird to any native English-speaker over the age of about ten. Every one of them, confronted with that, will respond with some variation of "Why, God? Why?"

If you're looking for a mathematically rigorous argument from me about why I think your comma use makes you look like you've got a shed full of spare ones that you need so badly to get rid of that you're just sticking them anywhere you can, then I'm sorry to disappoint you. There isn't one. Language isn't math.

you may find it to be logical, but you are not writting it gramaticaly correct. My school system sucked but we did cover grammer and learn how to use it correctly. Applying what I have learned in school, you are useing way too many commas. Although I am sure people have already told you that much.

Uh, yes.

Look, I don`t claim to be writing "correctly". I claim, that I`m writing logically, and do not mangle text beyond understanding.

Comas are much more abundant in Russian, and frankly, it is hard to read comaless sentences.

Don`t waste your time about "correct grammar" - I know perfectly well, that from orthodoxal point of view, I can be using too much comas. I`m merely saying, that I don`t drop them on random, but use them per logical rules.

There seems to be very little logic in their placement to me, but I'll warrant that may be because I've grown up speaking English.

I don't think your grammar has to be perfect, but if you know it isn't, then don't argue with us! That and, and I'm not asking this to be a smartass, would you mind explainin gthe logic behind some of those commas?

I put comas, where I make pauses at speech, mostly.

As for arguing, it was started by certain someone, who posted a log of private YIM conversation (Without asking permission, I might add.), to corrobate his claim, that my comas are wrong.

Therefore my argument, is that they are right for me - as they are logical. (No, right and correct are not the same things.)

Sorry I didn't ask your permission to post a completely anonymous chat log in order to prove to you that your grammar is horrible, and made up.

And grammar isn't math, so there's no way you're going to logically argue where commas should be. You put them where you pause, but that's wrong because commas aren't used to denote a pause. Propper sentence structure, with articles and all those crazy things you don't understand, create pauses and logical understanding. Excessive use of commas doesn't.

well, my thinking is just that it would sound weird to pause in all those places.

Except you're not.

read this:


I put commas


where i make pauses in speech


mostly




Do you see why there should be no comma between line 1 and 2?

"I put commas" makes no sense on its own.

Alice! I didn't know you were on primetime american television, Or that you were black.

Eh. I really speak with those pauses.

I guess I have atrocious accent, then.