when did the developers say anything about hell being scary and full of monsters?

most of what i remember them saying is that the game would focus on the single player, the game would have it's scary moments, the action would be intense, the later levels would look cooler than the earlier levels...

i think they generally backed up their claims with the game

if you come to a place where a large number of people enjoyed the game and go on a rant about how the game is a huge letdown to YOU that is slightly trollish... instead of posting when you cannot word your post in a way that isn't going to sound like you are bashing the game for a stupid reason take a while to calm down and post something like "did anyone else think hell could have been better?"... instead of a flamewar you could get a real discussion going me personally i would have done hell differently... i have some great ideas for levels taking place in hell... don't ask me what they are... if i ever make a game you will find out then



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LONG LIVE DREAMCAST!!!

what is this dopefish that everyone keeps talking about?



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I have found that you can transform your character solely by the power of belief: as you believe yourself to be, so you shall become over time.

This is bashing dooom 3:

*note: The following is not neccesarily what I believe.

Doom 3 was so sh*tty it was unbelievable. The graphics were so hyped up and everything looked like a god damned candle. The monsters are a bunch of short bus riders in bad halloween costumes with sh*tty sound effects. If they had kept Trent Reznor on board the sounds wouldn't have been so sucky, but as it is, they blow. The weapons completely suck. I mean seriously, the rocket launcher is the biggest pussy gun ever. They ruined it. Hell is a f*cking JOKE! It's like they just wanted to have one section of the game that is utterly sh*t beyond belief. I guess they copied everything else off of Half Life, why not follow suit in that department as well. So what we got for hell was red Xen. And what we got for the rest of the game is a dimly lit, plastic version of half life. At least it had nice blood effects. Too bad the god damned blood disappears after 4 seconds. Not to mention the fact that the bodies of monsters burn up like cigarettes. Yeah guys lets play a fun game called DO YOUR F*CKING JOB! If the engine can't hande the content of the game, DON'T RELEASE IT! What they did was a f*cking cop out. Burning up bodies after you shoot them. GOOD JOB GUYS! Congratulations on sucking, iD.

That is bashing Doom 3. What I have done in this thread up to this post is be straight to the point.

I repeat, this threat is not neccesarily how I feel about the game. Do not quote this post later trying to make me look like an *sshole.

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Change is never a choice. You change, and you are who you have become. And there's not a damned thing you can do about it.

well actually my last post was directed at your thread... not this one

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LONG LIVE DREAMCAST!!!

It just seems you got your hopes up, expecting the most brilliantist (I know it's not a word ) game ever. That's not what they were shooting for. Like Jim said, id wanted a solid SP experience to go with the awesome engine, and they delivered. The game had me sitting on the edge of my seat, wondering where the hell that demon behind me came from.

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I'm not an actor. I just play one on TV.

I think my "what I've said up to this point" comment goes for that thread as well.

And that's the thing, Avenger. This game exceeded my expectations in SO many ways. I was not excited at ALL about this game. I first got excited about it when I was standing in EB deciding what to buy. Ok, that's how "high my hopes were." But the game delivered very very well. And there were problems.. But the story is sweet and I'm willing to look past those problems... But they really dropped the ball with hell. Based on what had happened earlier in the game with the walls on fire and the screen always turning red... And the screams and whatnot... I was expecting hell to really be something f*cked up and scary... as... well.. hell. And it wasn't. It was a major letdown for me. Cause like I said in the other thread, or maybe this one, hell is basically just like a level from the game Rune. It's just a dungeon. And that would have been ok, if it had a ton of bad guys, and they actually tried to creep you out a little. They should not have taken the flashlight from you either. If they had made it really dark and creepy.. With screams and voices in your head and whatnot, it would have been much much better. I mean I want people screaming at the top of their lungs in the background. I want to see people being tortured and maimed. I want half corpses hanging from their arms on the walls. I want heads on spikes and I want a ton of f*cking monsters. That's what hell should have been. And they could have gotten away with it too. Have ammo everywhere and just explain it by saying there were tons of military expeditions down there lately. It's really simple... They got rid of the flashlight in that level.. so it had to be brightly lit. So there was no creepyness... No fear of what might be in the shadows.. Nothing. They turned it into a run and gun experience... and it just didn't have enough monsters to be a fun run and gun. And I already stated the fact that to compensate for the fact that the engine can't handle too many of the high poly models on screen at the same time... They made the guys tougher. More hit points. Yay. More hit points is not as good as more bad guys.

I think that pretty much sums up my complaints with the game. At least betruger is sufficiantly creepy.
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Change is never a choice. You change, and you are who you have become. And there's not a damned thing you can do about it.

[This message has been edited by Bill (edited August 17, 2004).]

***SPOILER (sort of)***

In the middle of this picture you can just make out a picture of the dopefish

right here

The l33t dopefish

[This message has been edited by CavEmaN (edited August 17, 2004).]

OMFG.

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There are two asses in Massassi... and I'm one of them.
The Matrix Unplugged|My Portfolio|My Levels

Bill, I really do agree with you on hell. While I though it was amazing as is, they really could have done better. I thought the whole "floating rock in space" with nothing but red extending out as far as the eye can see, was pretty cool. Maimed corpses and horrific screams would have greatly enhanced the environment. While I liked hell (that sounds so wrong ), the only gripe I really have with it was the level design, felt boring and uninspired. It was still cool though, imo.

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ZGPC

.....?

Anyway, I'd be willing to be my job at Sonic that Doom 3 gets blamed the next time there is a school shooting.

"Yeah, I remember that kid as kind of a loner. Always sitting around with his laptop playing Doom 3. DAMN THOSE VIOLENT VIDEO GAMES!"

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Friends is over. Kill yourself.

Man whats with all the griping about Doom3, it was a good game.

I'm not saying it was perfect, or the best game ever, but it doesn't worent all this whining about it.

Sure a few things could of been better, But is there ANY game where you couldn't say that?


You Know this extact same thing is going to happen when HL2 comes out, People are going to be complaining that it's too differnt, or too much the same like the first HL.

Or some guns or lvls could of been better and it runs like crap on they're systems.

PS. Don't talk about half-life like it was the 1st fps with rpg elements that are seen in that game

Strafe>system shock1&2>HL>doom3>soon to be HL2

Maybe a few more in that list but I even't played every fps ever made.

Maybe graphics in a game detract from the rest of it.

I got Doom 3 on Monday, and I've played it for about twelve hours, and I'm at the monorail skybridge, fighting my first batches of Revenants. I've enjoyed the game immensely, despite the fact that the game's at 640x480 on low, with only bump mapping and it still didn't run great - most noticeable was the 15-20FPS in heavy combat.

And I love it. I really do. I'm genuinely scared to go into a next area, because of previous experiences. I've been mauled to death by a bunch of trites, which really set me going on edge. I've been ripped a new one by lost souls, and their screeching not only left me in low ammunition, but it kept me searching for the noise, as well as cacking my pants. And then I've been cut up by chainsaws as I panic after seeing this half-naked bald, fat guy lurch towards me with a look of malice.

The physics are an idle distraction. I'm using Junkguy's mod which doesn't remove corpses (apart from demon ones, which dissolve eventually) and I have a bit of idle fun as I recall the awkward positioning of a pair of pinkies (Demonic porn? Pity I lost the screenie...) or have idle fun hacking a body up with a chainsaw and watching my trail of blood. And then I idly bash or shoot cans because they crumple and stuff. It's an idle distraction while I work up the balls to get to the next section.

The PDAs are great. I know some people say the e-mails subtract from the atmosphere, but I think it adds a lot of uniquity among the personell. I mean, they actualoly have different nationalities of people - there's an Irishman somewhere in the comm facility, I think, and a Russian somewhere else. Plus some Japanese or Chinese staff, as well as the different and non-generic accents of the American personell. And the rather comical sales pitches from UAC.

The demons themselves? They're different. Lost souls are definitely harder than before, as are the pinkies. The zombies are smarter, and the revenants are far easier. God, they were a bugger to take out in Doom 2. Trites are the equivalent of the Flood, yet scarier to boot...

I'm indifferent on the new arsenal. I'm using the pistol torch mod (I refuse to call it a flashlight), it improves the pistol somewhat. As a weapon, it's still quite strong and has a lot of force behind the blows, while being bloody accurate too. I use it against zombies to conserve ammunition, although I could easily use the chainsaw. The shotgun is okay, but I want to see a mod of the double-barrelled mother from the last installment. Hehe... The chaingun is slower firing than I expected, and the limited ammo in clips isn't fun, but it adds to the fear.

I think that's it, really. The levels are nice, if a bit dark, but it's a good atmosphere.

But like any new sequels to old games, it's not the original. It will never be the original, which was a distilled frag-fest.

My two pence for yer.

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Wise men say that fools rush in where angels fear to tread, so look before you leap, so to speak, because the grass is not always greener on the other side of the hill.

I love the way that everyone who played Doom3 and didn't like it feels that they've had a revelation that would shatter the Dalai Lama's world.

Everyone grab your pitchforks and forget Che Guevara, Bill is coming to light the flames of revolution in the western world.

Am I the only one holding my breath for Return to the Returning of Castle Wolfenstein?

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free mp3 ~Jump - Young America

new album Between the Dim and the Dark available now

A remake of a remake?

RTCW was a good game, especially the crypt levels that made me jump a few times.



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I have found that you can transform your character solely by the power of belief: as you believe yourself to be, so you shall become over time.

comparing trites to the flood doesn't work... the flood explode and go away when they hit you trites keep attacking and screwing your accuracy if you let one get too close

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LONG LIVE DREAMCAST!!!

I figured someone as intelligent as you seem would at least understand that most of the classic games lacked the ability to be complex, the engines got the general idea of the game done, but im sure the creators had something like Doom3 in their minds from the beginning. Monsters arnt scary in wide open, well lit areas. It's always more fun to take them down as fast as you can, and sure theres lots of ammo, but if there wasnt, and you completely ran out of ammo, even on EASY, you couldnt fist fight or flashlight whack your way out of a battle, even with the chainsaw (which is pretty useless itself) you couldnt fight off more than one or two guys before dying. I think its a great game, and I never liked the old doom games because they were just too plain for me...

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"Ahhhh!! I'm Burnin'! I'm Burnin!!!" - Cleaner from Max Payne 2

"Why are they called headphones... why not... Headspeakers?" - finity5

Indeed RTCW was great. ET, of course, was awesome too. I wouldn't want a remake, though; I am glad that the era of WWII FPS's are over.

Bill, have you personally been to Hell? Is it not scary enough to portray the realism? Did it strike in a religuously offensive manner? Come on, dude. Keep an opinion, not a mass repulsion to it.

I have said this once or twice before: regardless of how Doom 3 appears, it is basically a showcase in the end. The new engine needed a place to start, not necessarily a great innovation. Expect more from the future games, developed on this technology.

As for the comparison between the former Dooms and the latest one, the older games were basically frag fests. Fun? Possibly. Too simple? Definitely. I expect more out of an FPS than "KILL KIZILL KILL TEH z0rmbhi3s!"

Oh btw, Doom3 will never equal Doom. Why would id release the same game they made a decade ago and just rename it?

Bill--To say Carmack had nothing to do with designing, developing, or coding is stupid, asinine, and naive (sp?). IIRC, he hand-codes the engine all by himself, he might have a few people help him, but it's mostly him.

Of course, since you were let down by hell, that means EVERYONE was. Except half the people I talk to who have gotten that far think it's badass. Hrmmmm

Also, to say Doom 3 isn't original because of Half-Life is retarded. You know there's like 2 different things about the core story of Doom 3 from Doom 1 right? Half-Life drew off of DOOM if anything.

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There is no signature

[This message has been edited by Dj Yoshi (edited August 18, 2004).]

Quoted for truth. I'm sick of hearing how Doom's story was directly ripped from HL when it's obvious it's the other way around. After playing through HL when it was first released I remember thinking the story was ripped from Doom.

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This post was proudly brought to you by KegZ™ - Now with 38% more Spam

[This message has been edited by KegZ (edited August 18, 2004).]

Eh? DooM told the story of a single marine who fought off the forces of Hell after a mysterious gateway opened and out poured demons and monsters and Barbara Streisand.

Half-Life told the story of how a government officialy (G-Man) used Gordon Freeman to take out most of the forces of Xen so that he could then proceed to invade it and conquer it.

Similarities, yes. Ripping from? No.

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<ubuu> does hitler have a last name?
<jipe> .. yes, Ubuu, we're racist commy nazi jews, and we hate male pattern baldness
<Professor`K> Sorry, but half-way through your logic, my head exploded

I didn't say it was--bah, nevermind.

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There is no signature

I meant that lowest common denominators.

Scientist conduct high risk experiments.
Experiment goes horribly wrong.
Demons/Aliens start warping in killing scientists, security and whoever else is around.
You play as one guy who just happens to survive the initial accident who eventually makes it to the Demons/Aliens home dimension (Hell/Xen), then beat up on the bad guy responsible for the invasion (Spider mastermind/Nihilanth)

Half Life is just a really, really good Doom clone with it's story slightly tweaked.

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This post was proudly brought to you by KegZ™ - Now with 38% more Spam

and the hero has a beard.

dont forget it.

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Drugs & Stupidity, Tons of it.

Oh right, that makes a world of difference. Forgot about that Spe.

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There is no signature

think about how much gandalf would suck without a beard.

now that we understand one another you can continue with your existence.

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Drugs & Stupidity, Tons of it.

Half-Life and Doom had the same premise, not the same plot. And keep in mind the premise of "alien invasions" had been around a lot longer than either game. Doom didn't have much actual plot due to technology restrictions at the time (Educated guess, going by a lot of people who tell me that Doom had very little plot.) Half-Life had the same basic premise of Doom, but had an entirely different plot. Doom 3 would seem to have borrowed a lot from Half-Life's story. To put it as bluntly as possible, Half-Life didn't take anything from Doom because there was almost nothing to take. Doom 3 would seem to have taken a lot from Half-Life. Prove me wrong if you wish, I like to think of myself as fairly open-minded. This is just the conclusion I've come to given what information I have.

Plot/Premise aside, Doom 3 has some other things borrowed from Half-Life *coughmedicalterminalscough*.

Does this make Doom 3 a ripoff of Half-Life? No. Does this make Doom 3 a horrible excuse for a game? Not in the least. Does it make Doom 3 relatively unoriginal? From what I can tell, Yeah. But who really gives a crap? If you have fun playing the game, nothing else matters.

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Moo.

Because Doom had plenty of storyline--but a lot of it was implied and you didn't know it except through reading. It wasn't developed like Half-Life's. But it was basically there.

Face it, if anything ripped anything, HL ripped Doom. Doom 3 is really just a basic reiteration of Doom. It didn't steal anything, except maybe the health terminals, maybe, from Half-Life.

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There is no signature

HL wasn't great b/c of its storyline in and of itself, it was great b/c of how the story was told and the way it was presented.

If HL had botched its most excellent gameplay, it would have long since dissapeared into fps obscurity.



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I have found that you can transform your character solely by the power of belief: as you believe yourself to be, so you shall become over time.

Yoshi, you seem to be misunderstanding here. It's not the STORY that was ripped off, it was the EVENTS. The execution of the game. Many events in Doom 3 made me think "Man... this part of Black Mesa... err... The Delta Labs is really scary."

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Change is never a choice. You change, and you are who you have become. And there's not a damned thing you can do about it.

Lemme get this out of the way--I hate Half-Life. I hate it.

Now that that's done, Black Mesa reminds me NOTHING of Doom 3's labs, or vice versa. You forget Carmack had dreamt these things up long before Half-Life came to fruition. Think about it. They had just started working on it in 2000.

Bill you don't seem to understand--Half-Life is not original in any way, shape or form as far as events/storyline goes. [EDIT: As compared to Half-Life]

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There is no signature

[This message has been edited by Dj Yoshi (edited August 18, 2004).]

Well, let's revaluate the two games:

Doom: A martian space station run by the government conducts experimentation on creating space gates / teleportation technology. An accident occurs that winds up creating a portal to hell, allowing demons to invade the martian space stations. The marines stationed there are wiped out except for one lone marine. It is his mission to try his best to survive the invasion and hopefully put a stop to the forces of hell.

Half-Life: A group of scientists stationed in a secret test facility called Black Mesa in New Mexico are conducting experimentation on creating teleportation technology. They accidently create a portal to an alien dimension called Xen and the creatures from there start to invade the facility. The government soon learns of this incident and send marines to go in and kill everyone (both alien and the scientists). Gordan Freeman, the one that started the mess accidently, has to help the scientist stop the alien invasion as well as keeping out of the marines line of fire.

As you can see, both stories seem striking similar in a lot of ways. Will Half-Life's story is a little more developed and engaging, you can't help but notice that HL's premise is so similar to Doom's.

-- SavageX

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"...and if you don't like that, then you need to be slugged in the face repeatedly, until my hands are soaked in blood. Have a nice day!"
http://geocities.com/savagex378

Nope =] Im still waiting too.

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\(='_'=)/

Doom2 coop > Doom3

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Juztyn
Taking credit for: Canyon Stream, Higher Ground, The Space Between, Death's Dome (mlp3), bits of JKRPG, and the entire Showcase forum, damnit!... Visit SWGalaxies.net for the latest Star Wars: Galaxies information!

So thats the thingy that shoves its head through the door ...

Correct.



Besides the point really.

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Drugs & Stupidity, Tons of it.

DooM's story was implied? Where? Was it in the room with 20 zombies, or 30?

In addition, the resonance cascade that opened the portal to Xen was not accidental. The G-Man purposefully sent an unstable sample to create the portal.

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<ubuu> does hitler have a last name?
<jipe> .. yes, Ubuu, we're racist commy nazi jews, and we hate male pattern baldness
<Professor`K> Sorry, but half-way through your logic, my head exploded

story came in the text before the lvls,

and *if* I remeber right in doom 1(or 2?) you learn that that portal to hell was no mistake..

Besides if any thing, I would say doom3 is MUCH closer to system shock1&2 then to HL

Video games people...video games

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In Tribute to Adam Sliger. Rest in Peace

10/7/85 - 12/9/03

I never thought of the G-Man as a human; I believed it was just an alien in disguise. And the government invading Xen? Wowsers. Never saw any of this stuff.