I obviously don't know much about the situation occuring in Britain but I would just like to add that many, if not all, of the things that you mentioned also take place during revolutions (not that I'm saying this is one). During times of civil unrest in the U.S., thousands of poor people looted, burned buildings & even confronted police & military with violence. Sometimes these methods are effective & sometimes they're not. Stealing a television looks relatively ridiculous by today's standards but I'm certain that people probably looted items back then that seemed equally so for that time period. I suppose that my point is that there are often times in history where desperation trumps "civility" towards those "above" or in front of you & that the types of actions these people are taking don't necessarily say about them what many of you are indicating.

A problem with the arguments for the violence is that many of the groups/parties/organizations that usually organize violent demonstrations are against the rioting, the rioting has no political goal, no agenda and no aim for improvement. As far as everybody can tell the ones that are rioting now are doing so for either fun, thrill or free stuff!

Also I'm not sure most of those rioting are chav's (scum maybe ) though I'm not defending chavs as most bring it upon themselves. Sure they are "good" chav's but even they don't think about others, from personal experience chav's are only bothered about themselves and theirs and don't care in the slightest about how their actions affect others.
As pointed out chav's often live of the state, most often by choice, many have been given jobs but decide not to work and either quit or get fired for failing to do what they are paid to do. Despite chav's often been unemployed and living on benefits they can often afford more then us "working class".
Ignoring them doesn't work, some of them (not all but a good majority) take great fun in harassing others, your only options are to avoid or to confront, both options can make things worse.
But I digress, it would appear most of the rioters are just your average scum who do things just to please themselves or for personal gain.

there is also a difference between a lot of what happens during revolutions and what is happening(from what i can tell) in england. this isnt some pointed acts of rebellion aimed at specific targets that have "wronged" those who are rioting. if these rioters were storming state buildings or police stations that would be one thing. instead they are destroying peoples cars and homes and businesses. as one of the rioters said when interviewed "we are showing the police and the rich people we can do what we want" they said about breaking into shops "it was madness, it was good though, yeah. it was good fun."

So you're saying they're like Ohio State fans?

None of those things are unique except for maybe the part about cars but that's only because they didn't exist for much of history. I was discussing both times of civil unrest & times of revolution. My guess would be that the same types of statements were made during & after the Harlem Riot of 1935 (& many times before & since).

The violence has spread to Edinburgh.

Actually, when I asked what you DID to cause this problem, what shook the bottle, I was referring to the welfare state, not the racism.

Also the editor ****ing sucks at italics. Specifically, at turning them off.

Wait where did racism come into anything?

Scotland is so ****ed

Yeah but that's Thatcher's fault.

Well played.

I would actually be very interested in finding out what exactly the "police and rich" people DID to cause this. Because it does not seem like anyone knows... Not even the rioters...

I was hoping these rioters would wear V for Vendetta masks.

the only ones who would wear V4V masks would be those fighting the rioters.

Rob had some good points, but he has to live here to understand.

Its not - poor vs less poor -

Its purely a cultural standoff, violent uneducated vs slightly less violent slightly more educated.
A lot of those "poor" kids dont want to learn, dont want to work, the whole "its the tory's fault" is just an excuse.
They are animals. Period.

Its dying down now, but society is wounded. There will be more to come, I can only hope this time its the law-abiding striking back at the underclass*.

*rob, underclass is a phrase that does not mean class by income, it is a term for what we see as a destructive sub species of our society.

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An interesting read on the social networking aspect of it all.

I want to hear more about this. Did you know Omar?

VBS.TV just posted this video.

**** yeah! the turkish guys are bad ass!