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Heartbroken
2013-11-23, 2:18 PM #41
Originally posted by EAH_TRISCUIT:
How is 'woman logic' NOT a thing. I'm not implying male logic is superior but men and woman have vastly different hormones that influence our decisions.


Because 'woman logic' is literally a sexist strawman certain men use to disparage behavior with rational outcomes because they have been explained in a socially-motivated irrational way.
2013-11-23, 2:28 PM #42
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2013-11-23, 2:28 PM #43
Originally posted by Reid:
Well, 'woman logic' can and is used to express misogynist ideas. I doubt there's much solid evidence for it, even if people sort of 'get it' when you talk about it.


I can accept that. Not sure what criteria you would accept as evidence but there's a lot of scientific research on difference between male vs female behaviour in other species.
My favorite JKDF2 h4x:
EAH XMAS v2
MANIPULATOR GUN
EAH SMOOTH SNIPER
2013-11-23, 2:51 PM #44
Originally posted by Reid:
erm care to give a parable so i can see how this is applied?


"My girlfriend got in a huge fight with me for clipping my toenails in the living room, lol women am I right?" => she is really mad for something way bigger and more important but doesn't want to bring it up yet because it would end the relationship.

"She said she wants a nice guy but FRIENDZONED" => she wants a sexually attractive nice guy. also, you aren't actually nice.

"Cheated on me because [reasons]" => she was horny and figured sex with a different person was worth risking her long-term relationship, same as with men.
2013-11-23, 2:52 PM #45
'woman logic' a.k.a. white lies used to justify self-interest in a way that lets them avoid direct conflict with large predatory mammals twice their size
2013-11-23, 2:56 PM #46
[http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/317/295/0db.jpg]

Because women have been socialized to think that asking men out makes them look slutty. Also, plenty of women ask men out anyway, and if you've never been asked out it probably means you aren't very attractive. (sry)
2013-11-23, 3:44 PM #47
Originally posted by Jon`C:
'woman logic' a.k.a. white lies used to justify self-interest in a way that lets them avoid direct conflict with large predatory mammals twice their size


This may be the best thing I've ever read on this forum.
Also, I can kill you with my brain.
2013-11-23, 5:23 PM #48
Suggesting that men or women do certain things because of a difference in hormonal balance is to suggest that because of gender, pretty much the entire human race is incapable of rational thought.
>>untie shoes
2013-11-23, 5:29 PM #49
you know what would be a funny name? cringle mcdingleberry
COUCHMAN IS BACK BABY
2013-11-23, 5:42 PM #50
Space code button input pressed
Red card, blue card, open door
Put your karma to the test
Live but once, you push for more

Rockets roar, the space ship heads
Towards a bright distant star
Through a path of brilliant threads
Stars close by and stars afar

I stand watching as you fly
Wishing you success of mission
And I hope that you won't die
In a blast of nuclear fission

Speed bent time
And you've returned
You're so young, still in your prime
My old heart is badly burnt

My life followed a different plan
Gave me knowledge, wisdom, scars
I'm a man

You're from the stars

幻術
2013-11-23, 5:53 PM #51
Originally posted by Antony:
Suggesting that men or women do certain things because of a difference in hormonal balance is to suggest that because of gender, pretty much the entire human race is incapable of rational thought.


That might be an easy argument to make but it seems a little silly to try in this thread where the topic is heartache/relationships. Even if you could remove all emotional bias from these decisions then I think you would end up removing all the enjoyment as well.
My favorite JKDF2 h4x:
EAH XMAS v2
MANIPULATOR GUN
EAH SMOOTH SNIPER
2013-11-23, 6:11 PM #52
Originally posted by Koobie:
Space code button input pressed
Red card, blue card, open door
Put your karma to the test
Live but once, you push for more

Rockets roar, the space ship heads
Towards a bright distant star
Through a path of brilliant threads
Stars close by and stars afar

I stand watching as you fly
Wishing you success of mission
And I hope that you won't die
In a blast of nuclear fission

Speed bent time
And you've returned
You're so young, still in your prime
My old heart is badly burnt

My life followed a different plan
Gave me knowledge, wisdom, scars
I'm a man

You're from the stars



I like this.

Although, a bit too naturalistic for my taste, on closer inspection.
2013-11-23, 6:32 PM #53
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2013-11-23, 6:37 PM #54
Originally posted by EAH_TRISCUIT:
That might be an easy argument to make but it seems a little silly to try in this thread where the topic is heartache/relationships. Even if you could remove all emotional bias from these decisions then I think you would end up removing all the enjoyment as well.


OP's ex didn't do what she did because she's a woman. She did what she did because she's either a *****, or OP is an *******.
>>untie shoes
2013-11-23, 6:40 PM #55
Stop excluding the middle!
2013-11-23, 6:57 PM #56
Originally posted by Antony:
OP's ex didn't do what she did because she's a woman. She did what she did because she's either a *****, or OP is an *******.


Heh, my initial comment containing the phrase 'woman logic' wasn't directed to OP, it was referring to a post made by Admiral Zarn. And To be fair there really wasn't enough information in Zarn's post to reach any conclusion, initially I read "cheated on me because I wasn't Christian enough" as something his significant other actually said but it might have been his own conclusion.
My favorite JKDF2 h4x:
EAH XMAS v2
MANIPULATOR GUN
EAH SMOOTH SNIPER
2013-11-23, 7:11 PM #57
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
Stop excluding the middle!


There's a distinct chance that it's a fundamental personality conflict, but odds are good the relationship ended for the same reason most relationships end: a complete lack of empathy. One, or maybe both of them was acting like a douche for way too long.
>>untie shoes
2013-11-23, 7:28 PM #58
Hmm... that's an insightful post, but I choose to believe that outsiders like ourselves cannot divine the answer using logic, because we have limited information.

But wait: only a little ironically, just on page one I viciously defending the idea of stereotype and generalization, to give a quintessential example of conclusions based on limited information.

So I am forced to concede that your dichotomy may be the most probable explanation.

Now that I've checkmated myself and my head has imploded, I think I'll go play chess with myself and leave this thread to the grown-ups.
2013-11-23, 7:31 PM #59
(BTW, did you merely neglect it, or do you really not buy the "grass is greener" hypothesis?)
2013-11-23, 7:46 PM #60
That argument is fundamentally flawed because it relies on a constant truth. The grass is always greener. It's a product of irrational thought.

I'll use an example: I have a girlfriend that I've been with for a decent while now. I love her dearly. We have literally never had a fight of any kind. We always have fun together. Yet I still find other women desirable because it's a natural human thing to do. There's a girl that I work with who has magnificent D-Cup fake boobs and hits on me all the time, and while I would love to sleep with her, but I don't, because I have a stable relationship. So while my girlfriend doesn't have large fake breasts, I still stick with her instead of chasing someone else down. This is largely because I have the capacity for empathy. I know that if I banged the girl from work it would break my girlfriend's heart, so I don't do it, no matter how much I would like to, and no matter how awesome it would almost certainly be. My physical attraction to her is countered by my devotion to my girlfriend.

I don't buy the "grass is greener" argument because, as I said before, it's always seems true. It is, also as I said before, a lack of empathy.
>>untie shoes
2013-11-23, 7:51 PM #61
Is your empathy stronger than 6 beers?
My favorite JKDF2 h4x:
EAH XMAS v2
MANIPULATOR GUN
EAH SMOOTH SNIPER
2013-11-23, 7:55 PM #62
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2013-11-23, 8:19 PM #63
Originally posted by EAH_TRISCUIT:
Is your empathy stronger than 6 beers?


You forget who you're talking to here don't you? First of all, I don't drink at all anymore. Second of all, it would take a whole lot more than six beers to make me consider being unfaithful.

Originally posted by Reid:
Obviously the grass is not greener because you're staying with her, either from her attraction or the fear of not having anyone.

and the grass is greener does not always apply to every human at every second, obviously Dash_rendar's girlfriend was looking for an upgrade.


I mean it seems like the grass is greener. It's obvious that it generally isn't. That's the entire purpose of that saying. I stay with her because I love her and she makes me incredibly happy. I am able to use logic to discern that it would be highly unlikely for another woman to make me happier.
>>untie shoes
2013-11-23, 8:39 PM #64
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I like this.

Although, a bit too naturalistic for my taste, on closer inspection.


It was a lightspeed romance, Reverend. :XD:
幻術
2013-11-23, 10:38 PM #65
Originally posted by Reid:
obviously Dash_rendar's girlfriend was looking for an upgrade.


There is no human value continuum, you ****ing moron. Dash_rendar's girlfriend was in a relationship that she wasn't happy with. This doesn't have to reflect on Dash or her, because sometimes people are just not compatible. She was absolutely wrong to cheat on him, and obviously I won't excuse that. But this stupid ****ing idea that either she was right about what Dash was worth to her or she was wrong and she's an idiot to leave him ought to be tossed onto a pile of burning Cosmopolitans.
If you think the waiters are rude, you should see the manager.
2013-11-23, 11:14 PM #66
Originally posted by EAH_TRISCUIT:
Heh, my initial comment containing the phrase 'woman logic' wasn't directed to OP, it was referring to a post made by Admiral Zarn. And To be fair there really wasn't enough information in Zarn's post to reach any conclusion, initially I read "cheated on me because I wasn't Christian enough" as something his significant other actually said but it might have been his own conclusion.


Fair enough. That was the reasoning she cited for both the cheating and the breakup.
I can't wait for the day schools get the money they need, and the military has to hold bake sales to afford bombs.
2013-11-23, 11:37 PM #67
Originally posted by Antony:
That argument is fundamentally flawed because it relies on a constant truth. The grass is always greener. It's a product of irrational thought.

I'll use an example: I have a girlfriend that I've been with for a decent while now. I love her dearly. We have literally never had a fight of any kind. We always have fun together. Yet I still find other women desirable because it's a natural human thing to do. There's a girl that I work with who has magnificent D-Cup fake boobs and hits on me all the time, and while I would love to sleep with her, but I don't, because I have a stable relationship. So while my girlfriend doesn't have large fake breasts, I still stick with her instead of chasing someone else down. This is largely because I have the capacity for empathy. I know that if I banged the girl from work it would break my girlfriend's heart, so I don't do it, no matter how much I would like to, and no matter how awesome it would almost certainly be. My physical attraction to her is countered by my devotion to my girlfriend.

I don't buy the "grass is greener" argument because, as I said before, it's always seems true. It is, also as I said before, a lack of empathy.


No, see, what you just described isn't actual empathy. If you have to restrain yourself, you're faking it.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2013-11-23, 11:48 PM #68
Originally posted by Freelancer:
No, see, what you just described isn't actual empathy. If you have to restrain yourself, you're faking it.


Bull****. No one doesn't have bad impulses. We're human because we exercise restraint, not because we're somehow the only animal that's completely immune to the pull of thousands of years of evolution.

And since I'm already replying to you, as a Christian, I didn't ever have the slightest sense that Emon was describing me in the post you found objectionable, and I immediately recognized the sort of behavior he identified as "Christian logic," because I see it all the time. Basically, he's absolutely right.
If you think the waiters are rude, you should see the manager.
2013-11-23, 11:55 PM #69
+1 everything macfarlane just posted
2013-11-24, 3:02 AM #70
Christian logic was described as cheating on your SO because they don't believe in your religion. Do you not find that objectionable?

[quote=Michael MacFarlane]No one doesn't have bad impulses. We're human because we exercise restraint, not because we're somehow the only animal that's completely immune to the pull of thousands of years of evolution.[/quote] I think staying faithful out of a fear of personal consequences is not the same thing as staying faithful because you love and respect your SO. I think intentions matter. Basically what I am saying is that to a lot of people, the outcome alone isn't good enough if it's for the wrong reason.

I don't agree that people have bad impulses regarding values they actually hold. When values you actually hold are violated or you think about violating them, it is repulsive. It just so happens that a great many people don't value monogamy. If you're one of them, let your SO know that up front and save the both of you some heartache.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2013-11-24, 4:16 AM #71
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2013-11-24, 4:22 AM #72
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2013-11-24, 4:28 AM #73
Originally posted by Freelancer:
Christian logic was described as cheating on your SO because they don't believe in your religion. Do you not find that objectionable?
As long as there are Christians who worship greed because they misunderstand both the material conditional and the Bible, no, I don't find the assertion that Christians are mentally ****ed to be objectionable.

You want more examples of Christian logic? Amway, sovereign citizenship, childbirth as punishment, John Locke and the good Rev. Thomas Malthus whose abominable brain farts are used to this very day as a guidebook to the decay of all capitalism.

By and large, Christians are not only poor at their worship, they are terrible people in the rest of their lives. The rest of us are painfully aware of this fact. What are we supposed to do, though? Pretend those people don't exist? Get offended when people call us out as a whole for being destructive and greedy?

Quote:
I think staying faithful out of a fear of personal consequences is not the same thing as staying faithful because you love and respect your SO. I think intentions matter. Basically what I am saying is that to a lot of people, the outcome alone isn't good enough if it's for the wrong reason.
There's this little thing humans do called rationalization, where we internalize an excuse for behavior (to the extent that we even believe it) because the true motivation is too socially unacceptable for us to be honest about it. Intentions matter but there is a very big difference between the true intention that guides behavior and the stated intention ex post facto.

Quote:
I don't agree that people have bad impulses regarding values they actually hold. When values you actually hold are violated or you think about violating them, it is repulsive. It just so happens that a great many people don't value monogamy. If you're one of them, let your SO know that up front and save the both of you some heartache.
no true scotsman
2013-11-24, 4:29 AM #74
Originally posted by Reid:
of course there is no continuum, we're only talking about Dash_rendar and a possible alternative. Certainly some people are more attractive than others.

My guess is she was already looking, at least subconsciously, for a different partner for a while.

If she's really attractive, then she gets approached by guys all the time, so the fact that they had a solid relationship for over a year means Dash_rendar has a lot going for him. I can only speculate as to what happened, bro.

Well, in this case I'd say that on a purely carnal level, you would absolutely prefer the other woman. The problem is there is too much risk, too many other factors keeping you from wanting to do that.

Dash_rendar's ex-girlfriend obviously didn't have much holding her back. Now obviously we can all agree that the relationship was probably going sour for a while before the first incident, which is why I'd say she was probably talking to different guys and considering them as potential partners for a while. If she's attractive, she's given plenty more opportunities by men. So it's more likely that she will find a more solid "upgrade" in terms of objective qualities of people. Yes it's ****ed up, it's shallow, it's cruel and Dash_rendar doesn't deserve it, but I'll be damned if it doesn't happen often enough to be a trend. She's her own person, and if she wants to leave Dash_rendar for another man, she can. But it's obvious where she stands in her opinion on Dash, which is why I recommend he never take her back, which may be hard if she's good at manipulating and comes to him with the waterworks running.

And no, I'm not implying that people only chase after superficial qualities, as in your case you prefer a companion that you love being around to the bimbo-type that you're more sexually attracted to. That's perfect for you because an emotional connection is obviously what satisfies you.


reddit dot com slash r slash pua itt
2013-11-24, 4:40 AM #75
like reid it's cool that you've decided to finally start talking to women, but maaaaaaaybe a forum full of people with pork pie hats and patchy neckbeards isn't the best place to get advice on heuristic evaluations of women and top techniques for locally-maximizing your relationship metrics
2013-11-24, 4:51 AM #76
as much as I condemn evo psych as a pseudoscience I think it's unquestionably obvious that we are all subjected to evolutionary pressures to recombine our DNA in creative ways, and just because someone isn't self aware enough to analyze their own behavior on that basis does not mean there is some relative full ordering of men by sexual attractiveness or whatever the **** you people are talking about.

like our serum cortisol drops off after 1-2 years of an unproductive romantic relationship so we're even hard-wired to seek out other mates in the event of nesting failure.

if you do not have an instinctive understanding of this process you are literally not sentient.
2013-11-24, 4:53 AM #77
Originally posted by Jon`C:
no true scotsman


You're right. My post came off pretty masturbatory—as though I am a qualified arbiter of human morality and there is something defective with you and why don't you come join us well-adjusted people? I'm actually a tinfoil nutball outlier who can't come to grips with the fact that other people are different.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2013-11-24, 5:21 AM #78
Originally posted by Jon`C:
By and large, Christians are not only poor at their worship, they are terrible people in the rest of their lives.


ROFL.
My favorite JKDF2 h4x:
EAH XMAS v2
MANIPULATOR GUN
EAH SMOOTH SNIPER
2013-11-24, 9:25 AM #79
that sucks...my fiance left me about a month after graduating basic. it sucked, i still hurt from it, however it sortof helped being deployed 9 months later, though i am home now being alone really really really sucks. i'm going to college, trying to fit in, asked a girl out friday to the movies, got turned down. rejection is a *****, and this world is cold and heartless.
Peace is a lie
There is only passion
Through passion I gain strength
Through strength I gain power
Through power I gain victory
Through victory my chains are broken
The Force shall set me free
2013-11-24, 11:31 AM #80
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