I had this IRC conversation about the topic with a Massassi person who is special but not in a negative way. I thought I'd start a thread about it, although there have already been such threads.

Do you think feminism is really aiming for dominance rather than equality? Do you think people who ask what I just asked are chauvinists longing for our caveman times?

This person I referred to in the first chapter of this post (who he is is irrelevant, by the way) suggested that the studies about the difference in men's and women's wages are biased because they compare men who have had time to advance in their career to women who haven't. I'm not sure he had anything to back this up with, though, I didn't ask for proof, I don't think it was a debate anyway. I'm still interested if it's true though, because I hadn't really thought about it until now. I know the wage issue is only the tip of the iceberg, but in this case I suppose the tip is enough to sink the Titanic of equality, at least this is the message that I get from listening to the feminist stance.

What's equality between sexes, anyway? Can we be truly equal with all our differences?

(I'm sorry for that Titanic analogy, by the way.)

I think it is an aim at dominance, they already have equality and the rest is just whining.

I agree.

There's still a bunch of cases where women really are being disciminated against, but the vast majority of what I've seen so far were *****y women who feel superior to men. I don't think equality can really be reached, people will always go over the line, and whenever a man complains about it, he's labeled a sexist. Same thing can happen with racism. You get black people getting special rights, and if a white guy complains about it he's labeled a racist.

I'd say they already "have it easier" in today's society. Feminism needs to stop existing.

Now that's what I'm talking about! That was amazing!
I mean you, I, tikketaba, hasdba, fasdja...
I'm buying you a pizza!

Yes, it's VERY overdone. Just like alot of racist-card players, a ton of feminists want things handed to them and if they aren't they cry and whatnot about unfairness.

I like the sexual exploration and pride part of feminism

I hate feminism. While I think women should have the same opportunitys and rights as men, most feminist take it to the extreme and think they should be dominant over men and whine when they feel that are being belittled.

BTW, gotta love this quote:

woman> Where would men be without us women?
man> We'd still be in the Garden of Eden you stupid *****.

^ Love that one

I agree that in many cases it's overblown, and that's why it gets the publicity that it does.

These are better:

What is the opposite of feminism? (for males?)

Chauvanism?

circle jerking?

[rant ahead..... brace yourself. ;p )


Feminism is a joke. They expect everythign to be handed to them instead of having to work for it like everyone else does.

Feminists are not so much against men as they are against women, and against themselves. Have you ever noticed how most feminists are fat, and are as ugly as week-old s***? You will probably never find an attractive feminist. These women (and i use the term loosely) are unable to be feminine and they are probably resentful as f*** of the beautiful women that get all the attention, so they blame it on men for "supporting these demeaning displays of sexuality." Rather than embracing their sexual nature (and realizing that men must also embrace theirs) and improving themselves, feminists hide behind masks of political correctness and sensitivity training b/c they are unable to deal with the truth. Feminism is a lame-a** excuse to allow fat chicks to get fatter without reproach, to allow ugly chicks to blind everyone that looks at them without consequence, to allow obnoxious women to be considered respectable, and to make dirty whores feel virtuous. Feminists feel the world has dealt them a bad hand, so they are rebuilding the world in their nasty andogenous image.



in a sense, feminists are fighting against their own sex. Feminists are not feminine, so they attack feminity and use men as a scapegoat for all their problems.
The real purpose of feminism is to crerate a slushy androgenous world where differences between the sexes are eradicated on the surface so feminists will not have to deal with their own inadequacies. They are not sexually appealing, so they want to eliminate all visible sexuality in women so they won't have to be jealous. They want to level the playing field at the expense of everyone else.

Its caklled Enlightenment.

...Enjoying hot man sex?

If there weren't any in the first place, then one wouldn't know the difference.

Feminism is just as bad as affirmative action. One can't give certain groups of people some special privileges and expect everything to be better. All it does is create more problems.

Page, women like the one you described isn't a feminist. She would be classified as a psychopath.

how do you figure?

Every political ideology has it's rational people with certain inclinations, and also it's irrational people with twisted agendas. Those latter people are usually said to be insane.

And yes, feminism is a political ideology.

I know a couple flaming feminists that aren't fat.. in fact, all of the ones I know aren't. Not saying that my opinion == all opinion, but you can't really just go around making huge sweeping gestures..

I think they have a fair point, and while they might not be going about it the best way possible, they still are often discriminated against. Teachers, for instance, get about .75% of the pay of a male teacher, who has been working the same amount of years, the same level job, and has the same degree in the same subject.

I think a lot of you are looking at the PETA/Animal Liberation Front type Feminists.. "We'll slaughter five men before we let an animal die" (PETA or ALF example) type feminists. The people I know don't go around trashing and hating men, they just want an equal chance to do things.

*shrug* I'm not against feminists, because put yourself in their shoes. How would you feel if you were a woman? (And please, no one say "myself" or "all over" :p)

I think in some situations -- such as where women are paid less than men for the same job -- feminism is appropriate. However, in cases such as "Mr. Pibb" becoming "Pibb Extra," feminists who pursue equality and not dominance get a bad rap.

happyud: I think you meant 75%. .75% is like a quarter an hour. O_o

Hmm, I'm for equality. If there's a feminist who wants total equality between men and women, that's great. I want it too.

But more likely, I'm for a new world order where there is just biological 'man' and a 'woman', otherwise there's just homo sapiens sapiens and voilà.

Considering the difference in wages: Somebody has to actually pay the money. If all the wages were suddenly equalised (=the wages of women brought to the level of that of men, because the other option is impossible) that somebody paying the wages would need a lot of extra money suddenly. From the employer's point of view, the difference saves real money. There doesn't need to be anything else behind it.

Obviously, this isn't right, and obviously, the number of cases is shrinking day by day.

You forget, most male teachers are also Coaches, and that in turn pays extra to them. It also gives them a bonus iirc. Just saying...

Well, there are some "normal" feminists out there. My history/politics teacher claims herself to be a "feminist", but she doesn't fit my definition. She's extremely cool, my favorite (serious) teacher so far in high school. And she's definitly not "ugly as week old ****" - she's 32, all the students think she's like 24, and she gets carded at the liquor store... I'm not trying to pull a Cloud here but.. heh, you know where I'm going with this

the so called wage gap is a popular feminist fallacy. They claim that men earn more than women, but that is only half true. Men do earn more than woman BUT AS A WHOLE, not for doing the same job. it is very illegal to pay men more than women for doing the exact same job, assuming that both are equally qualified and possess the same degrees, training, etc.

Men earn nmore as a whole simply because there are many more men in the workforce than there are women. Face it, most men work. Although a signifigant portion of women work, there are a lot of stay-at-home moms and homemakers that choose not to work.

There are female coaches too...

and in a public school, there are only so many coaches.. And a lot more teachers..

And yeah. I meant 75%... Sue me. :p

But anyway, that was a real example. My 9th grade gov't teacher gets paid 75% of a male teacher, teaching the same classes (actually less, he doesn't teach the AP classes she does), and he doesn't coach or anything..

You guys are all painting feminism and feminists with a broad brush. Way to be ignorant.

Then why not say something informative instead of just bashing everyone in this thread?

I've had feminists slash my friends' tires just because they were 'rich males'. Sorry man, but their fanatacism and overall stupidity forces us to draw these conclusions. If 95% of muslims were like the few radical groups, I'm sure someone would eventually commit genocide on the Muslims. However, it's nowhere near 95%, unlike feminazis (yes I said feminazis, not feminists, don't confuse it when I say the two. I'm talking about the radical feminists.)

Except teachers don't get paid by the hour.

Also, happydud, are we talking about gross or net wages here? I ask because there would be a difference in taxes for teachers who are married and single teachers.

Why not say something informative instead of just bashing all feminists?(this isn't directed at you in particular, I'm just making a statement)

Dj Yoshi: 95% of feminists are crazy extremists? How would you know this?

Ah, good ole' Pagewizard. Thanks for the laugh, I needed that. I mean I half-agree with you, it's tjust the way you say it that makes it so funny..

Actually, a study here at Mizzou (University of Missouri-Columbia) conducted by the psych depeartment (for reasons that I don't know -- simply going on what my teacher said in lecture) showed that female professors and graduates (such as teacher's assistants) were paid less than men who were doing the exact same job -- for example, should a professor have a male and female TA, both of whom were doing the same magnitude of work, the male would be paid a greater hourly basis.

Granted, the gap has shrunk exponentially (it's said that, between 1970 and 1990, it shrunk 1 percent per year), but the gap does still exist.