fun

Hey mother****ers what the hell happened to turn the other cheek?

Crappy *** Christians.

Trust me Spook, in this thread it's not the christians causing all the problems -_-

Deadman! How dare you imply the Jews are causing all the problems!

Nazi.

Maybe he's from 卐 Swastika, New York 卐

btw i thought it was cool windows had a swastika symbol im not a neo nazi dont ban me thx

You're right.

*****y Christians and Whiny Atheists.

You're all looney, the lot of you!

You sound very Tolkien like. Why? I dunno. WHy am I positng thi? I dunno weith.

Well I do fancy myself a writer.

I shall now retire to my study and smoke some pipeweed.

I have a friend who can get you some... "pipeweed"... >_>

Best weed in the shire, it is.

I actually get paid thousands a month to cultivate the most screwed up forum on t'interwebs.

.

ITS TIME TO CUT THIS THREAD DOWN WITH THE...

Wait what? Paid? Or is there another more screwed up forum on t'interwebs that you farm?

once again, froma different source, (which seems less biased than the last one i posted) chalk it up to mistranslation, and it seems quotes taken out of context.

it seems like in Romans 1, God was punishing former christians for returning to pagainism and worshiping idols and having HETEROSEXUAL orgies, the punishment being making them have homosexual orgies.

You forgot Allah.

And did you know Elohim is plural?

I would question the credibility of that site because it is trying to justify religious tolerance with scripture. This is typical of those who call themselves Christians but turn out to be quite liberal in their beliefs. Basically, if you try to justify something that is contradicted in scripture with human reasoning, what you're advocating probably isn't right to begin with.

It goes back to what I said before, about how Christians are made to be new creations by God through faith in Christ. Once this happens, your ties to your past as a sinner are severed in regards to your spirit; since your soul is a new creation made incorruptible by partaking of God's own righteousness, it is impossible for your new spirit to sin.

You start to see sins like homosexuality the way God sees them, and as a result, they become detestable to you. If you were saved out of that lifestyle, your flesh (which has not been saved yet) may wish to return to it, but if you are truly a new creation, you cannot live in the ways of the flesh without your spirit being grieved. Paul specifically reprimands this behavior in Romans 6:12-23.

It is safe to say that any believer who slides that far without any remorse at all should really question their salvation.

Also, in Romans 1:18-32, Paul was specifically addressing the unsaved. Nowhere does that passage reference lapsed "believers". Just because the epistle of Romans was addressed to believers doesn't mean that 18-32 was referencing believers as well. Rather, it was meant to explain the true scope of human depravity, and how God will ultimately turn the immoral over to the passions they have entrapped themselves in (v. 28) To say otherwise is a logical stretch that attempts to justify behavior clearly condemned by scripture.

For comparison, the church in Corinth was the most pagan of the churches that Paul founded, and he had to admonish them as well for sexual immorality in 1 Corinthians. In fact, Paul specifically gave instructions to expel all unrepentant, habitually immoral believers from the church, since these people disrupt the rest of the ministry by their very presence. The same argument could be applied to homosexuals who claim to be believers, since I have already noted that Paul condemned that as well.

Allah is not the God of the Bible.

According to Christianity I guess.

But according to Islam (who's followers are way more devoted and faithful than most Christians), it's the same God.

I ask you the same question I would ask them: If it is the same God, then why is the Bible so different from the Koran in terms of message and doctrine? Theoretically, if God was the same in both instances, the Bible and Koran would closely parallel each other.

[edit] Muslims are more devoted simply because they believe their salvation depends on their works. Christians are justified by faith, so many of us get complacent since our salvation is assured. However, I do not condone that behavior either, and neither does scripture.

Your thinking of the Amish.

[quote= Romans Chapter 1 New American Standard version]

21For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22Professing to be wise, they became fools,

23and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.

24Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them.

25For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. [/quote]

this passage says clearly to me that the people he was talking about went back to pagan ways from not being so.


[quote= Romans Chapter 1 New American Standard version]

26For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural,

27and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.

[/quote]

the bolded text in verse 26 implies that God is responsible for making them perform homosexual acts.

[quote= Romans Chapter 1 New American Standard version]

28And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper,

29being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips,

30slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,

31without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful;

32and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

[/quote]

here again in verse 28, the bolded text implies that as punishment for not acknowledging Him, God punished them with depraved minds, or even just allowed the depraved mind to develop, leading to all the following things in the subsequent verses.

also, do you think paul is really the best mentor for a good christian? the man who said slavery is okay, even necessary? the man who is one of the main reasons women were treated the way they were up till about 40 some years ago?

one more thing, Romans 6:12-23 has nothing to do really with Romans 1:18-32, other than it is a sin to engage in sexual acts outside of marriage, (speaking of, you used to be the "pimp" of massassi. did you find god and stop your womanizing ways?) and it is a major sin to worship anything other than god.

Muslims believe that Christians distorted the teachings of God, which is why God had to reveal the Qur'an through Muhammad. "Allah" is merely the Arabic word for God: Arabic Christians refer to the Christian God as Allah.

What that really means is that people knew of the existence of the true God (ever since the beginning) if only on a subconscious level, but instead chose to pursue idolatry and other immorality due to having inherited total depravity from Adam. The urge to worship something is a common trait in humanity; transcending cultures and time.

Just knowing about and believing in God is not enough to call yourself a Christian; even the demons acknowledge the existence of God. Salvation can only come from Christ, and it is impossible to be a new creation and hang onto your old life.



God had not chosen them. God simply left them to wallow in the depravity that they were already a part of.



Depravity starts at birth; it simply becomes more refined through life. You are either in Christ or you are an enemy of God, more or less.



Paul did not so much advocate slavery (slavery in the Roman Empire was much different than the slavery that was practiced in America) as he called slaves to submit to their master's authority, and for masters to treat their slaves well, since the masters were also under God's authority. Also, where did Paul say that slavery was necessary?

On a different vein, God has a specific hierarchy for life here on Earth. Children are to submit to their parents, and fathers must not exasperate their children. Women must submit to their husbands (since man was created first) along with that, husbands are called to love their wives as they love themselves. Above all, Christian men must submit to Christ.

Paul is one of the best mentors that the church ever had, since his life is a lesson of the drastic changes that can happen to someone once they come to newness of life in Christ. Paul (as Saul) went from being one of the greatest persecutors of the church to being one of the Apostles, and it was all God's doing. There is no one too foul and depraved for God to call to newness of life.



Romans 6 is a calling for Christians not to live under what they have been saved out of, but rather to live in accordance to the new nature. If someone was saved out of a past of homosexuality, they are called to present themselves as tools for God to use, rather than continue to live in what they had been doing before.

As for me, the person I used to be is dead, never to return. Once, I lived for the things of the flesh (I stole, lived for myself, and did many other things that I will not go into) , even though I had a church background that I gradually wandered away from in my youth because I let my flesh take over. God did not give me over to the mess I had gotten myself into, but instead brought me back and allowed me to understand the very things that I have communicated to you. I'm lucky that I survived my past unscathed in the flesh, but many others are not so lucky. What matters now is that I am a new creation. When I began to understand that, I had the admins change my user title, because "Ultimate Scoundrel" did not describe who I was anymore.

Regardless, Christianity and Islam could not be more different on the things that matter.

i guess this is a perfect example of how interpretation of the bible can be so different. we're looking at the same words and seeing different meanings.

i too grew up close to the church, so close my mother was an ordained minister. she was later disallowed from having a congregation, for the simple reason that she has a chemical imbalance in her brain. She has never given up on God, even though the church gave up on her.

I myself, drifted away from the church, even before they put my mother out on her ***, because of things i saw within it. Corruption, hypocrisy, fear, hatred, an unwillingness to accept others...

I still have faith in God, but no faith in Christianity as an institution. there is no Christian denomination that is without guilt in some respect, and i feel that in most cases the evil done by the institution far outweighs the good done.

I live my life as Christ would want, modestly, lovingly(to a fault at times,) and on the whole i do not see myself as a bad person, though there are many many churches that would see me go to hell for refusing their doctrine. i just dont see how a person living as christ would have it, but refusing the institution can be seen as sinful or evil.

Scripture often requires Christians to go against the things of the world and to reject the teachings/customs of the world to stand for the truth. We are called to stand firm and to test any new ideas/doctrine against scripture. In this case I will never twist the scripture to accommodate what society says I should.



It is not the "institution" of the church that is important. The church is actually not a building, but is a group of believers who are united in Christ. Believers are called to minister and edify each other to keep the doctrine pure, because without good doctrine, a church is nothing more than a social club filled with self-righteous people accomplishing nothing. When there is no control over what is taught, the church becomes corrupted, resulting in the sort of behavior you describe.

If you are living as Christ would require (with the work of the Holy Spirit being made manifest through a new, regenerated spirit, in accordance with what the Bible teaches) then you are doing well, regardless of what a formalized institution would tell you.

In fact, Paul warns about those sort of people, saying that you should allow no one to rob you of the joy that you have through Christ by telling you that you have to follow some additional system to be truly right with God. (Colossians 2:8)

However, do not be deceived in believing that you are good enough for God if you have not been made new by the work of the Holy Spirit. What people believe to be good and what God believes to be good are two completely different things.

In Hebrew, using the plural of Elohim does not denote a purality of gods. It's used to suggest majesty, greatness and holiness. At least in that context.



Arabic speaking Christians use the word Allah. Allah is the god of the bible because Allah is simply a word for god.



Keep telling yourself that man, it won't make it any more true. You see, I guess you don't really get what the big J dawg is telling you.

I do believe Jesus said somewhere in a book that, ironically, was NOT written by Matthew;



Now, for Muslims, they have what are called the 5 pillars of islam

[quote=Big M dawg (blessings of peace be upon him)]
-Faith or belief in the Oneness of God and the finality of the prophethood of Muhammad;
-Establishment of the daily prayers;
-Concern for and almsgiving to the needy;
-Self-purification through fasting; and
-The pilgrimage to Makkah for those who are able.[/quote]

Now, hmm, wait, let us look at those. Take the first two and the last two, what, what what?

Faith in God and praying to him daily, travelling to Makkah to show devotion to the faith he has instituted on earth, and purification to make oneself worthy for his grace.

versus.

'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

YE GOD(S)! They are similar yes?

Better yet, Pillar number three...

Concern for Almsgiving to the needy, and self purification (I include this because people purify their posessions by setting aside a portion for the needy)

versus

'Love your neighbor as yourself.'

Oh ****.

I dunno, but I always thought the only things that mattered in Christianity were devotion to God and your fellow man. At least, thats what those damn Mormons believe. Oops sorry, they aren't Christians. My bad.

Anyway, If you want to tell me that devotion to God and caring for your fellow man don't matter, go ahead, but I'm pretty sure James will rise from the dead and come to kick your *** for ignoring everything his brother taught.

Islam and Christianity share those two tenets at their core. This is ignoring the cultural corruption that plagues both religions. That stuff doesn't matter. The fact that they both claim different authority lineages from God, doesn't matter. The fact that one believes in a triune god and one of a totally singular god, does not matter, in truth.

Sure, it does make a difference, but in the spirit of the religions, it has no bearing.

Devotion to God.
Care for other people.

If you want to argue with that, take it up with MC Jesus.

Only in a linguistic sense, nothing more.



You must ask yourself where the love of God comes from. By default, man is born separated from God (the God of the Bible) and hates the very things of God. I see it all the time from unbelievers (especially here at Massassi)



You fail to understand the difference between the works-based system of Islam and the newness of life that Christians experience.

Muslims do works to try and present themselves as righteous to their god Allah. The motivation for their works is external and is being applied externally. Their works are based on a system of law.

Christians cannot be more different. We do not live based on law, but on freedom in Christ. We have newness in Christ and we have God's own righteousness within us as a result. (as I have said many times) Because of this, we are essentially reprogrammed to do good works by our very nature as a sign of the work that the Holy Spirit has done within us by regenerating our souls. This is what James meant when he said that faith without works is dead. Our motivation is internal and is being applied externally, but it is not from ourselves. Without Christ's work, we are nothing, since nothing acceptable to God can come from us unless the Holy Spirit has been at work within us.


For the moment, I have work to do, so I will get back to this discussion later.

I really have no idea where this thread has gone too. I don't even know what you are discussing, or even why. I know I started this mess with a loose comment and my pride trying to defend my self, but thats irrelevant at this moment. What are you discussing right now?

I'm done talking to you Page. At least when Gold is wrong he gets pissed and invalidates himself. Cool calm irrationality is frightening to me.

Can you really define what Muslims believe for them? Even if you can, it's hardly more bizarre than believing a cosmic Jewish zombie sweat blood and died so you could hate on other people.

Wow, Page, do you consider your god different from the Jewish god as well?

Hey, I get pissed off at insults and offenses, not arguments. I also can't read 1000 words per second, so I am obviously not going to be refuting every single post, since I can't finish reading one without having to consider another one.

This is true.

Classic. I love the original though. I'm guessing there a lot of Weird Al fans that have never heard it.

Read the thread.

Anyone who was alive in the 90s surely heard it at least once. It was popular if I remember right.

Coolio actually didn't give permission for Al to parody the song, but there was a miscommunication between Coolio's people and Al's people. Coolio was pretty pissed off. I believe Weird Al now talks directly to the artist/band himself so that that never happens again.

The Quran is different from the bible because they are very different things. The bible is a "historical" account of God, Jesus, etc. The Quran is a series of revelations revealed to Muhammad.

No. I simply live under the new covenant.

The Law (Genesis - Deuteronomy) is the old covenant, and it's purpose was to reveal God's righteousness. Since humanity is by default fallen in both spirit and body, the law inevitably condemned everyone as well. By being impossible for any man to completely keep, the law revealed the extent of man's depravity and emphasized the need for a savior. (which I now have under the new covenant.)

By being under the new covenant, I have been freed from the law. Rather than spending my life fruitlessly struggling to keep the law with my original soul and flesh and ultimately gaining nothing for my trouble, Christ took the death that I deserved under the law into Himself, and as such my spirit could be brought from a state of death into a state of incorruptible life much like Christ was. (now we only wait for the regeneration of the flesh) This means that every believer who is in Christ is blameless before the law in spirit and is perfectly just and righteous before God in the present and forever more.

Sounds like a loophole some reformist Jews made up to get out of the old laws.