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ForumsDiscussion Forum → Another one of my Jehova Witness threads...
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Another one of my Jehova Witness threads...
2006-01-26, 5:02 PM #41
Originally posted by Avp2MattJa:
yes it does, though im not a JW, my mom is.

Okay, tell me what then? Because I honestly can't fathom how giving devotion to God could interfere with a process that takes all of 5 minutes.
D E A T H
2006-01-26, 5:18 PM #42
Yeah...I'm not seeing how voting detracts from how much you are devoted to God.
Bassoon, n. A brazen instrument into which a fool blows out his brains.
2006-01-26, 5:23 PM #43
[QUOTE=Dj Yoshi]Okay, tell me what then? Because I honestly can't fathom how giving devotion to God could interfere with a process that takes all of 5 minutes.[/QUOTE]


i dont fully understand it, so any JW's correct me if im wrong here.

but ur suppost to only worship 1 God, and that is Jehova, nothing eles, voting, pledge of the all. is worshiping someone or something that is not God and is wrong.

now thats what i understand, i still havent deicided what religion im going to cause i need to research them and pick for myself, so me voting, who knows.
Matt
2006-01-26, 5:25 PM #44
Voting != worshipping government
$do || ! $do ; try
try: command not found
Ye Olde Galactic Empire Mission Editor (X-wing, TIE, XvT/BoP, XWA)
2006-01-26, 5:40 PM #45
Not by a longshot...
Bassoon, n. A brazen instrument into which a fool blows out his brains.
2006-01-26, 5:54 PM #46
Originally posted by Emon:
Not by a longshot...




well thats ur opinion now isnt it?
Matt
2006-01-26, 5:59 PM #47
If anything, voting is a sign of your distrust...
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2006-01-26, 5:59 PM #48
Originally posted by Avp2MattJa:
well thats ur opinion now isnt it?

...no, it's not.
D E A T H
2006-01-26, 6:16 PM #49
Originally posted by Darkjedibob:
Voting != worshipping government


Voting is picking which candidate best represents your views on several matters of importance so that they don't collapse into chaos. Hardly what I would call worship.
"We came, we saw, we conquered, we...woke up!"
2006-01-26, 6:17 PM #50
Originally posted by Avp2MattJa:
well thats ur opinion now isnt it?


no, it's not.
$do || ! $do ; try
try: command not found
Ye Olde Galactic Empire Mission Editor (X-wing, TIE, XvT/BoP, XWA)
2006-01-26, 6:28 PM #51
I don't see what could be gained by this. If Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe in voting, what other radical beliefs would they start lobbying for if we were able to convince them to? :p
2006-01-26, 7:57 PM #52
Originally posted by JediKirby:
But if he's got this heaven business, the whole "giving life" thing seems sort of like a 'game,' doesn't it? Why would he do that? To test you? So if he's so good, why does he test his subjects?



Why does he have to test us?

If he knows everything, then he should know who's in and who's out automatically.

CALVINISM.
2006-01-26, 8:12 PM #53
Originally posted by Rob:
Why does he have to test us?

If he knows everything, then he should know who's in and who's out automatically.

CALVINISM.


Yeah but you and I both know that people like us would have a flying fit if he just said 'you're a bad person you are going to hell' and we never got the chance to even really screw up.

See, the thing about all this stuff people like Kirb say (if then statements) depend on THEIR particular view God and how the world should be. At the same time, you (Kirb) talk about relativism (or, I think you do, I could be wrong but I remember you talking about this) even in the same post 'maybe we don't believe the same as you' along those lines.

Of course, I don't believe in God either, but I like to attempt to be open minded.
Epstein didn't kill himself.
2006-01-26, 8:23 PM #54
Originally posted by JediKirby:
But if he's got this heaven business, the whole "giving life" thing seems sort of like a 'game,' doesn't it? Why would he do that? To test you? So if he's so good, why does he test his subjects?


Insecurity. ;)
2006-01-26, 8:31 PM #55
Originally posted by Spook:
Yeah but you and I both know that people like us would have a flying fit if he just said 'you're a bad person you are going to hell' and we never got the chance to even really screw up.


I don't care.

I'm not afraid of someones imaginary friend.
2006-01-26, 9:03 PM #56
God gives you free will because he doesn't want us to be mindless robots. He wants us to serve him out of our own will, not out of fear or obligation. The devil wants you to worship him instead of God, however he has nothing to offer really, and God does.

God wanted us to fill the Earth, take care of it, be happy, live forever in Paradise and of course serve him. How ever... this was lost six thousand years ago, and will be restored soon.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-26, 9:04 PM #57
He made us to serve... Yeah, my musical lyrics stand. You're going to shake that eyes hand.
ᵗʰᵉᵇˢᵍ๒ᵍᵐᵃᶥᶫ∙ᶜᵒᵐ
ᴸᶥᵛᵉ ᴼᵑ ᴬᵈᵃᵐ
2006-01-26, 9:05 PM #58
Originally posted by SF_GoldG_01:
God gives you free will because he doesn't want us to be mindless robots. He wants us to serve him out of our own will, not out of fear or obligation. The devil wants you to worship him instead of God, however he has nothing to offer really, and God does.

God wanted us to fill the Earth, take care of it, be happy, live forever in Paradise and of course serve him. How ever... this was lost six thousand years ago, and will be restored soon.



CONTRADICTION.

Even if God gives us "free will," being all knowing he would STILL KNOW if you were going to be a **** off or not. Therefore giving us life would be useless, unless he is a sick ******* that likes watching children starve to death, and women get raped.
2006-01-26, 9:06 PM #59
Your leaders predicted the end of the world in the 70's, Gold. Why do you trust them?
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2006-01-26, 9:07 PM #60
He made us to live in peace, happily. He gave us a set of rules, that are pretty simple to follow, but Eve was deceived, by listening to the devil, and Adam listened to his wife, something he should not have done, and there they both proved their loyalty and trust in God. The devil tests us, not God.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-26, 9:11 PM #61
Originally posted by Freelancer:
Your leaders predicted the end of the world in the 70's, Gold. Why do you trust them?


My "leaders" never made any prediction of the sort. For my religion has no "leaders". Only the loud mouth idiots said that, simply because we would have passed the 6000th aniversarry of when Adam and Eve sinned.

We don't know when the world will end, we never have known. How ever, we know what the signs are that show that the world is soon coming to an end. Believe me, we are in the winter of this system of things.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-26, 9:11 PM #62
Originally posted by SF_GoldG_01:
something he should not have done,


Umm, what about that whole thing about it had to be done for humanity to even come to pass :p
"DON'T TASE ME BRO!" lol
2006-01-26, 9:13 PM #63
Originally posted by Rob:
CONTRADICTION.

Even if God gives us "free will," being all knowing he would STILL KNOW if you were going to be a **** off or not. Therefore giving us life would be useless, unless he is a sick ******* that likes watching children starve to death, and women get raped.


He gives you the choice; Adam and Eve had a 50/50 chance, like everyone else, fair enough.

This means, not all of the future is certain, some things are, but some things are left to your own decision.

EDIT: I'm going for the night, I'll be on tomorrow after school.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-26, 9:15 PM #64
*Me wonders why Gold never answers my questions
"DON'T TASE ME BRO!" lol
2006-01-26, 9:23 PM #65
Originally posted by SF_GoldG_01:
He gives you the choice; Adam and Eve had a 50/50 chance, like everyone else, fair enough.

This means, not all of the future is certain, some things are, but some things are left to your own decision.

EDIT: I'm going for the night, I'll be on tomorrow after school.



...

THERE IS NO CHOICE. THERE IS NO FREE WILL.

God either KNOWS ALL, or he DOESN'T.

If God KNOWS ALL, then he KNOWS what YOU WILL DO in the future, and there is NOTHING that will change that, because God CANNOT BE WRONG.

So obviously, life on Earth is a pointless waste of time, as an all knowing being he knows what you will do, and could pass judgement THEN. You know, instead of letting children STARVE TO DEATH, AND NEVER EVEN GET A CHANCE AT THIS BULL**** TEST YOU SPEAK OF.
2006-01-26, 9:24 PM #66
Originally posted by SF_GoldG_01:
... my religion has no "leaders".


Please explain the contradiction between this quote and the following Wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jehovah's_Witnesses#Organizational_structure. Jehova's Witnesses are organized in a hierarchy, according to the article. They also have a Governing Body that presides over the church.
"it is time to get a credit card to complete my financial independance" — Tibby, Aug. 2009
2006-01-27, 8:10 AM #67
like i said before, don't listen to gold. the wiki is correct however.
gbk is 50 probably

MB IS FAT
2006-01-27, 1:45 PM #68
Originally posted by Rob:
...

THERE IS NO CHOICE. THERE IS NO FREE WILL.

God either KNOWS ALL, or he DOESN'T.

If God KNOWS ALL, then he KNOWS what YOU WILL DO in the future, and there is NOTHING that will change that, because God CANNOT BE WRONG.

So obviously, life on Earth is a pointless waste of time, as an all knowing being he knows what you will do, and could pass judgement THEN. You know, instead of letting children STARVE TO DEATH, AND NEVER EVEN GET A CHANCE AT THIS BULL**** TEST YOU SPEAK OF.


Nobody knows the future, for it is not certain. He knows what is most likely to occur, he knows our weaknesses, how ever, he knows the choice is your alone. He is not the one creating starvation, its greedy people, driven by what drove the devil, greed.

When I say we don't have "leaders" I mean there is no big mucky muck that says when the world is going to be finished or that we think represents Jesus on Earth. In fact, here is what the wiki says of the governing body:

"The Governing Body supervises all the activities of Jehovah's Witnesses throughout the earth. This includes writing, translating and publication of literature, planning the program of congregation meetings, arranging for circuit and district conventions, sending out missionaries, making appointments of elders, ministerial servants, as well as circuit and district overseers, and arranging for disaster relief."

Also, listen to this:

During the 1960s and early 1970s, many Witnesses were stimulated by articles in their literature [7] and further encouraged by speakers at their assemblies prior to 1975, to believe that Armageddon and Christ's thousand-year millennial reign would begin by 1975. Although the views of Armageddon and Christ's millennium beginning in 1975 were never fully or explicitly supported by the Watch Tower Society, many in the organizations' writing department, as well as several leading Witnesses[8], Elders, and presiding overseers in the organization, heavily suggested that Christ's millennial reign over earth would begin by 1975. One outstanding example is an lecture[9] by then Vice-President Fred Franz in early 1975 pin-pointing after sundown on September 5, 1975 as the end of 6,000 years and saying all the prophecies "could happen" by then, while admitting that looked improbable. (Franz 1999a)
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-27, 2:20 PM #69
Read: You're in a cult.
ᵗʰᵉᵇˢᵍ๒ᵍᵐᵃᶥᶫ∙ᶜᵒᵐ
ᴸᶥᵛᵉ ᴼᵑ ᴬᵈᵃᵐ
2006-01-27, 2:25 PM #70
Originally posted by SF_GoldG_01:
Nobody knows the future, for it is not certain. He knows what is most likely to occur, he knows our weaknesses, how ever, he knows the choice is your alone. He is not the one creating starvation, its greedy people, driven by what drove the devil, greed.

When I say we don't have "leaders" I mean there is no big mucky muck that says when the world is going to be finished or that we think represents Jesus on Earth. In fact, here is what the wiki says of the governing body:

"The Governing Body supervises all the activities of Jehovah's Witnesses throughout the earth. This includes writing, translating and publication of literature, planning the program of congregation meetings, arranging for circuit and district conventions, sending out missionaries, making appointments of elders, ministerial servants, as well as circuit and district overseers, and arranging for disaster relief."

Also, listen to this:

During the 1960s and early 1970s, many Witnesses were stimulated by articles in their literature [7] and further encouraged by speakers at their assemblies prior to 1975, to believe that Armageddon and Christ's thousand-year millennial reign would begin by 1975. Although the views of Armageddon and Christ's millennium beginning in 1975 were never fully or explicitly supported by the Watch Tower Society, many in the organizations' writing department, as well as several leading Witnesses[8], Elders, and presiding overseers in the organization, heavily suggested that Christ's millennial reign over earth would begin by 1975. One outstanding example is an lecture[9] by then Vice-President Fred Franz in early 1975 pin-pointing after sundown on September 5, 1975 as the end of 6,000 years and saying all the prophecies "could happen" by then, while admitting that looked improbable. (Franz 1999a)


Quit drinking the water in Mexico.

Its bad for you.
2006-01-27, 5:39 PM #71
so far Gold's right, and u people think u know everything about a JW when ur not even one!!! whats up with that??
Matt
2006-01-27, 6:07 PM #72
HALLOWED ARE THE ORI
Stuff
2006-01-27, 6:32 PM #73
Originally posted by Avp2MattJa:
so far Gold's right, and u people think u know everything about a JW when ur not even one!!! whats up with that??


Heh... I'm not a true Witness either... so go figue.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-27, 7:02 PM #74
And you need to be part of the cult to call it a cult? I think we've learned enough about it to deduce as much.

Honestly, it's a mini-government of religious twirps who pick and choose what to believe out of some floppy textbook written by a bunch of hebrews after toking up with a peace-keeper called Jesus.

Seriously, people, what's harder to believe: The above, or that there's this gigantic force that controls us all, it has a cosciencous being, and makes decisions and plots things around us? Which HONESTLY makes more sense? It's like making some gigantic story up about a ball not being in my left hand, but instead, being in a time paradoxial loop that formed it in my left hand 5 minutes before I put it into my right, that's why you picked the wrong hand with a ball in it. Do you believe that, or do you think I used some l slight of hand ****?

I have never had a single bible thumper offer anything as simply logical, or sensical as my above argument. Honestly, WHICH makes sense?
ᵗʰᵉᵇˢᵍ๒ᵍᵐᵃᶥᶫ∙ᶜᵒᵐ
ᴸᶥᵛᵉ ᴼᵑ ᴬᵈᵃᵐ
2006-01-27, 7:03 PM #75
Did they defeat the old spirits and cast them out? And now, with the strength of our will, they do call upon us to prevail against the corruption of all unbelievers. Fear not the Ori, fear the darkness that would conceal the knowledge of the universe. Believe in the truth of all things, and you too may find the path to enlightenment.
Stuff
2006-01-27, 7:11 PM #76
Originally posted by JediKirby:
And you need to be part of the cult to call it a cult? I think we've learned enough about it to deduce as much.

Honestly, it's a mini-government of religious twirps who pick and choose what to believe out of some floppy textbook written by a bunch of hebrews after toking up with a peace-keeper called Jesus.

Seriously, people, what's harder to believe: The above, or that there's this gigantic force that controls us all, it has a cosciencous being, and makes decisions and plots things around us? Which HONESTLY makes more sense? It's like making some gigantic story up about a ball not being in my left hand, but instead, being in a time paradoxial loop that formed it in my left hand 5 minutes before I put it into my right, that's why you picked the wrong hand with a ball in it. Do you believe that, or do you think I used some l slight of hand ****?

I have never had a single bible thumper offer anything as simply logical, or sensical as my above argument. Honestly, WHICH makes sense?


Look... when ever you are about to do something, if you know it is wrong, are concious and aware of your actions, and still do it, you are at fault, for you could have just as easily not have done it.

EDIT: I remember at one time there was 500 dollars on some counter, and I was alone, no one around, I could have taken the money, and gone. But I just simply didn't, I knew it was wrong, and did not do it.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-27, 7:13 PM #77
And the people shall deliver unto you the wicked for your divine judgment, where their sins shall be weighed in the balance of all that is just and true.
Stuff
2006-01-27, 7:17 PM #78
Originally posted by SF_GoldG_01:
Look... when ever you are about to do something, if you know it is wrong, are concious and aware of your actions, and still do it, you are at fault, for you could have just as easily not have done it.

EDIT: I remember at one time there was 500 dollars on some counter, and I was alone, no one around, I could have taken the money, and gone. But I just simply didn't, I knew it was wrong, and did not do it.


That doesn't have anything to do with what I just said...
ᵗʰᵉᵇˢᵍ๒ᵍᵐᵃᶥᶫ∙ᶜᵒᵐ
ᴸᶥᵛᵉ ᴼᵑ ᴬᵈᵃᵐ
2006-01-27, 7:21 PM #79
Originally posted by JediKirby:
That doesn't have anything to do with what I just said...


I didn't even know what you said, I only assumed you were talking about chosing from right or wrong.
Nothing to see here, move along.
2006-01-27, 7:21 PM #80
Those who reject the path to enlightenment must be destroyed. Those who seek the path to enlightenment must not be led astray!
Stuff
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