Sweetener!! Why are you on the forums but not in the irc? =p

What's wrong with the 'theory'. Either (non-statistical) laws of nature describe the world perfectly. That means that if you could gather enough molecules to build the universe, you could simulate it entirely. Or the laws of nature are described by chances, which means you could never simulate it accurately.

The point is (apart from my overly simplified physics) that there is no magical free will. The point is our brain is a computer. Either (theoretically) statistical or entirely (theoretically) predictable.

What's wrong with this? Please do tell me.

My computer's dead - I have to use my other computer that my brother has dibs on (because I told him he could use it until he gets his own) so no irc because no consistent 'puter.

Where's the 'free computer' thread when we need it?

:(:(:(

It's much harder to hit on you through the forums...

Who wouldn't?

The point is (apart from my overly simplified physics)[/quote]
That's why you're wrong. You don't take into account randomness of quantum mechanics. The universe could never be simulated even if you could build a computer large enough to do so. Anyway...

That's why you're wrong. You don't take into account randomness of quantum mechanics. The universe could never be simulated even if you could build a computer large enough to do so. Anyway...[/QUOTE]

There was a giant thread discussing that.
I don't remember what the conclusion was, except that it undoubtedly finished with people still in disagreement (which is natural, can't expect everyone to share the same opinions on everything). Seems to me though, that even if you can predict someone's choice, that doesn't mean they didn't choose.

Though my mind boggles as to why this thread is discussing it. (and yet I contribute to the hijack, I suck)

The end result of the discussion was that Deadman is an Aussie hick.

1) I'm pretty sure that need help did explicitly take into account the randomness of quantum mechanics. In a non-quantum model of the brain as computer: given the same inputs, the brain returns the same value every time. In a quantum model: given an input, the brain mixes it with some random variable, and then gives an output that may not be the same every time. The problem is that meaningless randomness isn't any more choice-like than pure determinism.

2) Deadman, I empathize with your notion that "even if you can predict someone's choice, that doesn't mean they didn't choose." It's the line I used to use to argue against the Christian notion of predestination.

The problem is: can you explain what it means for someone to choose something? They weigh the factors, and come up with an action? Then do you consider every computer program to be making choices whenever it responds to an input with an output?

Tsk Tsk

That's the difference between real nice guys and fake ones, obviously.

My little brother is one of these "fake nice guys". He truly believes he's a nice guy, yet he's the most sexist, obnoxious guy I know. He'll make any claim against women without even thinking about it, calling all women whores or whatnot just because some of the girls he knows like to flirt with people or have already had sex (16 years old btw).

And then there's me. I don't want to call myself the nicest guy in the world, I'm not, I've done some things in the past that I'm not proud of, but I'm definitely the nicest guy around. Especially now that I've learned from past errors and have since corrected myself.

Never would I do a single thing to harm a women, nor a man (unless either of them did something serious - and I mean serious). I'm also not that bitter about the world at all, I'm just scared of it a bit. So much required to simply live - kinda scary at times.

Anyway, nice guys do exist, but true nice-guys are extremely rare. Easiest way to find them is in a nerdy gaming community

False.

Gaming communities are one of the worst places to look for men. Especially if one of your criteria is "somewhat attractive".

Also, they're comprised more of the "fake nice guy" category than the "true nice guy." (to go by your terms)

Seriously. Srsly.

I'm what you call "an average guy." Get used to dealing with guys like me.

Average, in every way.

I don't think there's no actual nice guys. Nice is a pretty lame character trait. If you're defined by your niceness, then you're going to be dull. The desirable guys out there have more than you can say about them other than just being nice. It's like seeing a fancy car and saying that it gets you from point A to point B.

For the record, I'm a jerk. To everyone I meet.

I think that women enjoy a little bit of both. They want a guy that will treat THEM right, but they don't mind if he's a little... eh.. "bad-***" (can't figure out the word right now im too tired).... So long as it's just a little bit. They like the macho-ness because they like to feel secure, and having a "big strong man" makes them feel secure in this way. But they don't want a juice head that's so dumb he doesn't know how to tie his own shoes. I'm faily certain that women, for the most part at least, want something on the in between. Someone to treat them right, stand up for them, be able to protect them if it ended up coming to blows, and someone secrure in both themselves and their lives.

Of course, I'm speaking on women. Not young or even older teenage girls. Two completely different sets of female's if you ask me.


And when it comes to the bedroom, you can't tell me women do not like a little bit of the rough stuff

I don't think I'd go that far.

I used to be the nice guy, and then I realized that got you nowhere. So I grew up.

So, yep, women are all pretty much identical, so it totally does make sense to generalize about what they want.

Instead of, like... asking someone directly what she wants?

By nice, I just mean someone that's going to be good to you. So not a dbag. But expanding on (or putting my own spin on) what stat said, so many people are so concentrated on trying to be "nice" that they don't seem to have an actual personality. Then they bemoan the fact that they're nice, so why isn't anyone interested in them? Obviously it's because women are all liars who want to be mistreated!

Also - there seems to be this thought that just because someone doesn't like dbags, she's supposed to like every single nice guy that comes her way. Otherwise, she's just "one of those girls that says she likes nice guys but is obviously a liar."

[edit] Vornskr - of course, you're right; different women want different things, but I think Temperamental pretty much hit the nail on the head with what *a lot* of women are looking for

Sugarless, I think you get the wrong impression of me.

In all honesty, I treat the women I date very very well, but I've had very bad luck with women in the past and have developed a bit of a mean streak when it comes to this sort of thing, so I come off as callous and prick-ish.

I really shouldn't lump all women together in one pot, but I'm still pretty jaded from the last one I dealt with. So I take back what I said earlier in this thread. I shouldn't jump to conclusions and make assumptions.

No biggie. I know I didn't speak particularly kindly about men after one broke my best friend's heart. Stupid - it's not like the whole male gender did it to her, but that's how it goes.

But it wasn't all directed at you, either. I've gotten the "all squares are rectangles, so therefore all rectangles must be squares!" theory from a lot of people over time.

the voices tell me to and I must obey.

I've been with my girlfriend for 10 years this July. I've forgotten what dating was even like or how people were so stupid on them.

I'm a bit estranged from dating these days. The last one really did a number on me... and hell that's been 2 years ago.

*gag*

Funny how women have that affect on us eh..

Yeah... she's had that nickname for years....

Yeah... I totally read those words in the wrong order. Ick.

As far as I can tell those are full of wankers.

That was a lie to make Massassi feel better.

Don't get me wrong, when I say "nice guy" I'm talking in general. Everyone has a dark side. Mine, for example, is if you lay a finger on my GF in any inappropriate way, I'll kill you.

But I agree with stat to some extent. It's true that many of the people who focus on being nice end up without personality... ok well they have one, but it's definitely not a desirable one. Even a mundane person has a personality, it's just extremely lame. I wouldn't factor me into this as anyone who knows me personally will never forget me, I'm crazy.

But that's probably because I don't "focus" on being a nice guy... it's just how I am. -.-


For the record: if I do see a nice car, I would say "That'll get me from point A to point B", but that's because I don't really care for cars.

You're sure expounding upon it quite voluminously in this threaddddd

Hey if there's any girls here do you want to go out with me?

I forget which ones of you are the girls,.

Sure thing, stud.

Lay off, he's mine.

Sorry ladies, I'm taken

You have really stubby fingers.

I could take a photo of my hand and say the exact same thing...