The open carry movement is started to make some noise around the SF Bay Area. Currently, in most Bay Area counties CCWs (Concealed Weapon Permits) are NOT issued (California is a "May Issue" state) which is essentially Non-issue for many urban and suburban counties. The Open Carry law (no license required, of course) dictates that your weapon must be holstered and cannot be loaded however you are permitted to carry loaded mags. There are a number of people who would like to push for legalizing loaded open carry, and there are even more people who wish to make California a "Shall Issue" state.

Personally, although I support the open carriers, I probably wouldn't do it myself if I owned handguns. I know people claim to be lighting quick at loading mags, but the only time you would ever have to load a mag is if a bad guy draws a weapon, and if that's the case his was probably loaded to begin with and you're a goner. My thoughts on open carry might change if loaded open carry was permitted, it's beyond ****ing stupid in my opinion that you can't open carry loaded, carrying around an unloaded weapon doesn't sound smart.

I am MOST in favor of making California "Shall Issue" when it comes to CCW, with proof of hands on handgun training mandatory (not the online handgun training tests that some states require for concealed carry permits). It doesn't have to be strenuous training, just basic stuff to make sure you know not to do stupid things like point it at crowds of people etc and how to make sure it's unloaded.

Probably almost a useless discussion for anybody outside the bay area because most the country isn't stupid about people carrying guns around, concealed or not, but still....discuss.

My brother loves to carry his gun around in Kentucky (a "gold star" open carry state). I don't personally like to see people carrying guns in public unless they're hunting. I'm perfectly fine with people owning guns & keeping them in their home or in their vehicle for protection or for the next revolution, but I just don't see the purpose of carrying them around like that. If more people are carrying guns around it just makes it that more difficult to recognize the bad guys.

CCW permits in FL are fairly easy to get, but I don't know the state of the open carry laws. Won't make a difference in a couple months when I'll have mine

I look at it this way, the ***hole in Fort Hood may not have claimed as many victims if the open carry was more in effect at that time on that Installation. I think it looks bad that a civilian policeman had to do the Job of what could have been done by MP's or other military security, and I would ponder on the thought that if a person went postal against his comrades in a combat situation he wouldn't last for 5 seconds. The Right to bear Arms is more like a priviledge that can be easily violated if not take wisely. It should only be in defense only, and hunting of course. For myself personally, It would feel quite awkward to carry heat out in the open, unless if it was a common site. I hope that Im not offending any liberals with voicing my opinion on this matter.

By definition, wouldn't a liberal be more in favor of expanded personal liberties? (Expanded weapon rights?) Oh wait, liberals in the u.s. are basically watered-down commies. boo.

I lol'ed

This thread makes me

So you let any would be mugger know WTF is up.

You do know you can't just shoot someone because they looked suspicious or because they tried to mug you. Real life is not the movies. "I thought he was going to kill me" doesn't actually work. "He was about to kill me so I killed him first" could probably still land you with a manslaughter charge. Cops and soldiers are allowed to kill people. That's about it.

Depends on the state and then if you're on personal property.

Yes. Just murder someone because they're on your personal property doing something you don't like the looks of. There's a reason episodes of Law and Order are not part of the curriculum at Duke Law School.

Of course you can't shoot them for looking suspicious.

And you're wrong. In Virginia you very well can pull a firearm on someone for trying to mug you, no doubt about it. Of course you can't just shoot them dead, but if they decide to come at you after you've warned them, then you have the right to protect your property and certainly yourself.

I thought it was pretty much OK to carry a weapon openly in any state.

I mean, we have a right to bear arms. I was under the impression the only limitation of it was concealing weapons not being allowed. ( And obviously you wouldn't run around federal property or schools and stuff with a shotgun. )

*shrugs* Every place I've lived you could pretty much do whatever you want with guns. So maybe that's just what seems normal to me.

Yay for interpreting the second amendment. I wish the founding fathers would have had a strict composition instructor present while drafting the Constitution so she could have walked around smacking them on the knuckles and shouting "be specific!"

"...the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Pretty specific to me.

Wow! You've solved the problem of interpretation of the second amendment! That's all it took, this whole time? You just had to read it? No kidding... that's ****ing amazing. It just means exactly what it says, that we can all have guns and carry them around with us.

Oh wait this thread is about the fact that we have laws that state we can't just all carry guns around with us. IT'S NOT SPECIFIC!

But I do carry around guns all the time and so do a lot of my friends. So I don't know about the laws that say we can't.

I don't carry guns, I don't own any (Nor would I pass a background test, but that's beside the point)

Where I have lived, the rules I was subject to, there has never been an issue. So when I hear laws about gun restrictions and stuff, I'm confused.

Maine, Montana, and Vermont. Pretty much anything goes.

I'm 30 years old & have never been mugged. I don't even personally know anyone that has been mugged. If someone did mug me, I'm fairly certain that if they see me going for a gun, they'd probably shoot me in the face. If someone wants your wallet bad enough, they'll get it, even if you have a bazooka on your shoulder. I find that it's more constructive to simply avoid situations in which being mugged is likely than to carry a gun.

That's great I'm glad you or any of your friends have never been mugged.

But that doesn't mean it doesn't happen, and simply 'avoiding a situation in which you're likely to be mugged' is not always practical and unrealistic.

And not all muggers carry guns, most use knives to get in close actually. But don't get me wrong, if someone where to sneak up on me and grab my arm, demanding my wallet they will get it (not like they'll actually get anything out of it, don't carry cash), but if I have the upper hand like my buddy did in Richmond a few months ago, I assure you the attempted mugger will back down with a Springfield 1911 .45 pointed directly in his face.

Believe me I wish people didn't carry guns for the purpose of self defense. But until the day when every last human being on Earth is dead, that day will unlikely come.

open carry in large metropolitan areas is not something I would do for the simple reason that other people would be nervous around me and the firearm that is in plain view

out of sight out of mind

also last I checked Indiana doesn't allow any kind of carry open or concealed without a permit

You can always move to England if you dont like our 2nd Amendment.

Or I can stay here and antagonize "love it or leave it" dolts like you.

Oh, **** off. The exact contours of the 2nd Amendment are far from clear right now, as they haven't been litigated in earnest for decades. I mean, yeah, the Founders probably meant to protect some kind of individual right to gun ownership. Sure. But if you've read Justice Breyer's dissent from D.C. v. Heller, you know that it's not exactly an unqualified right, and it never has been. Complaining about the ambiguity of the 2nd Amendment hardly qualifies Bill for being kicked out of the country.

Yeah! All the other **** I do qualifies me for being kicked out!

Well, yeah.

That's absurd.

Out of curiosity, does that 2nd Amendment say anything about ammo?

I dunno, it's pretty cool here. The beer is good too.

I suppose that I've always seen the "right to bare arms" as a right to overthrow your government, or at least let them know that you can, when they become tyrannical. Now that we have spy satellites, unmanned aircraft, stealth bombers & one of the most powerful militaries in the world, it appears as if those days are over (unless you assume that the military would side with the people). I just hope that when the Christian Conservative army starts firing, they've evolved beyond Salem witch-burning tactics because myself & a few others here are ****ed.

I could report this insult to the admin, but this time I wont.

I meant it in the kindest way possible. I should probably have said "Don't be silly" instead.

I guess I would prefer open carry to concealed carry, atleast then I know who not to **** with.

Me too, almost. But UNLOADED open carry? Ridiculous, even if you have ammo ready at your side.

Ideal for me would be open carry of an unloaded weapon as a simple deterrent, with a loaded weapon concealed. Perfect.

How's this for a deterrent: Some people have concealed firearms loaded with one in the chamber ready to go. So...don't **** with ANYONE. (which is a pretty good rule regardless of their level of armament)

Personally I think that Open carry should be allowed anywhere, but I also personally would never do it. Unloaded open carry is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard of. Carrying an unloaded gun around is stupid and pointless. Even LOADED open carry is pretty silly...like playing poker with your pair of queens showing. Unloaded open carry would be like playing poker with your pair of 2s showing.

Can I ask what exactly the point of keeping your gun unloaded would be? I mean, assuming you wanted to do something bad with the gun (I assume this is the fear of people who are afraid of others having guns, yes?) then wouldn't you just load it? Kinda gives an unfair advantage which almost entirely defeats the purpose, doesn't it?

I just think that if people don't use the right, we might eventually lose it. It will slowly become more strict until the right is gone.

You can argue about if it is right/wrong all you want. But it's a constitutional right. That law should precede any state laws. I'm not claiming to be an expert about the full extent of the right to bear arms, or the way state laws work. But it is my understanding state laws can't contradict federal laws.

Not sure how the restrictions work with the the loading/concealed/open and stuff. But it seems to totally contradict the purpose of the right. I do think that people should have to register to be able to conceal a weapon, but if its out there, no biggie.

This thread looks so weird from the perspective of a Canadian. Carrying guns around in public? What is this, the wild west? I understand that it's one of your rights, and for many it's a personal belief as well, but I have to admit that seeing someone with a gun in public is pretty unnerving for me. I'm even weirded out when I see a cop with a gun.

By all means, have guns. Keep them locked in a cabinet and use them for hunting. Hell, keep them in a bedside drawer for home defense. But I cannot wrap my head around why anyone feels the need to have one on them all the time. It's just... weird. (Again, I'm not trying to say it's wrong, or bad - it's just an utterly alien concept to me)

I haven't looked in to the reasoning behind this but I would assume that it's in case a child or teenager (or anyone for that matter) decides to pull your gun out of your holster when you're pre-occupied.

If an individual is worried about that, they make guns only the owner can pull the trigger (In the words of O'Neill, it uses "magnets!")

But as a general pubic safety issue, it shouldn't be a problem. Someone don't need to knock a person out to get a gun.