Massassi Forums Logo

This is the static archive of the Massassi Forums. The forums are closed indefinitely. Thanks for all the memories!

You can also download Super Old Archived Message Boards from when Massassi first started.

"View" counts are as of the day the forums were archived, and will no longer increase.

ForumsDiscussion Forum → Inauguration Day, Inauguration Hooooooraaay!
123456789101112131415161718192021222324252627282930313233343536373839404142434445464748495051525354555657585960616263646566676869707172737475767778798081828384858687888990919293949596979899100101102103104105106107108109110111112113114115116117118119120121122123124125126127128129130131132133134135136137138139140141142143144145146147148149150151152153154155156157158159160161162163164165166167168169170171172173174175176177178179180181182183184185186187188189190191192193194195196197198199200201202203204205206207208209210211212213214215216217218219220221222223224225226227228229230231232233234235236237238239240241242243244245246247248249250251252253254255256257258259260261262263264265266267268269270271272273274275276277278279280281282283284285286287288289290291292293294295296297298299300301302303304305306307308309310311312313314315316317318319320321322323324325326327328329330331332333334335336337338339340341342343344345346347348349350351352353354355356357358359360361362363364365366367368369370371372373374375376377378379380381382383384385386387388389390391392393394395396397398399400401
Inauguration Day, Inauguration Hooooooraaay!
2018-02-17, 3:52 AM #7441
In other words, I think the objections he has come from ignorance and an unwillingness to hear and dialogue with the other side.
2018-02-17, 3:58 AM #7442
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
Hey, remember how bad the Equifax breach of personal information was? I'm sure these Russian spies had a whole bunch of other channels for such illicit information available to them, but what's to say that we all won't one day have the honor of being dedrauded by a foreign agent?

https://www.lawfareblog.com/russian-influence-campaign-whats-latest-mueller-indictment


That's not important to our leaders, though. What's important is making sure America stays whiter for longer through immigration policy - that's the primary GOP action item.
2018-02-17, 5:04 AM #7443
Originally posted by Reid:
That's not important to our leaders, though. What's important is making sure America stays whiter for longer through immigration policy - that's the primary GOP action item.


By the way, I'm not pulling this out of my ass:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/02/06/trump-immigration-plan-could-keep-whites-in-u-s-majority-for-up-to-five-more-years/?utm_term=.67e2fd8ab18d

Republicans are trying to pump the brakes on demographic changes to keep America whiter, because that will keep them in power without having to change how they operate.
2018-02-17, 9:17 PM #7444
Originally posted by Reid:
By the way, I'm not pulling this out of my ass:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/02/06/trump-immigration-plan-could-keep-whites-in-u-s-majority-for-up-to-five-more-years/?utm_term=.67e2fd8ab18d

Republicans are trying to pump the brakes on demographic changes to keep America whiter, because that will keep them in power without having to change how they operate.


I'm not going to pull out, and I'm going to make America marginally less white.

Lmao not true I'm only having ai kids
Epstein didn't kill himself.
2018-02-18, 7:11 AM #7445
[https://i.imgur.com/TNGThSP.jpg]
2018-02-18, 8:10 AM #7446
I'm rooting for the Zizek quotes account.
former entrepreneur
2018-02-18, 1:51 PM #7447
since this has become the sick Peterson burns thread: https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/965326368836898818
former entrepreneur
2018-02-19, 5:16 AM #7448
Originally posted by Eversor:
since this has become the sick Peterson burns thread: https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/965326368836898818


Lol, owned
2018-02-19, 5:18 AM #7449
[https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DWTYtRgXkAApzso.jpg]

The Daily Mail tries super hard to make Corbyn seem like a really cool guy.
2018-02-19, 3:27 PM #7450
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/19/pentagon-buildup-troop-recruiting-shortage-351365

Quote:
Nearly three-quarters of Americans age 17 to 24 are ineligible for the military due to obesity, other health problems, criminal backgrounds or lack of education, according to government data.


Christ, are we really that bad? Is being a healthy weight with a degree that rare?
2018-02-19, 4:42 PM #7451
lmao degree? Think high school
Epstein didn't kill himself.
2018-02-19, 4:44 PM #7452
Must be why I get random emails from recruiters.
2018-02-19, 6:36 PM #7453
Can confirm - talked to my friend who's a Navy recruiter, most Americans are not fit for service.
2018-02-19, 6:42 PM #7454
[https://i.imgur.com/2S8G998.jpg]

In case you haven't heard, yes, people are equating Russian Facebook ads with Pearl Harbor and 9/11.

Also that ad is objectively hilarious.
2018-02-19, 6:54 PM #7455
[http://i.4cdn.org/sci/1519072683985.jpg]

Don't speak outside your domain.
2018-02-19, 7:25 PM #7456
To be clear, no, Godel did not show proof is impossible without axioms. There exist entirely complete and consistent logical systems. What Godel showed was that, any such system complicated enough to permit arithmetic can't be both complete and consistent, which is much less general, as it applies basically only to a few restricted attempts to rewrite mathematics in logic, and says very little outside of that.

Basically all statements applying Godel's incompleteness theorem to anything outside of the formal discipline is incorrect.

This is the same mistake that's often made with popularized science: it's easy to breed false understanding and overconfidence in mistakes.
2018-02-19, 11:06 PM #7457
Originally posted by Reid:
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/19/pentagon-buildup-troop-recruiting-shortage-351365



Christ, are we really that bad? Is being a healthy weight with a degree that rare?


too many jelly donuts
2018-02-20, 12:16 AM #7458
But the part about "proof requiring an axiom" is not even the most flagrantly wrong part of what he wrote! I thought Peterson was interested in philosophy, doesn't that mean he's at least understood propositional logic and logical fallacies?

Let's break this down:

Let's agree that religion is based on unproven assumptions by definition, and therefore independent of all scientific inquiry. This means that belief in God is simply an axiom, and one can choose to either accept, or reject it.

But then we have this Jordan B Peterson guy, asserting the following:

• P is an axiom ⇒ P is "faith in God"

In other words, there are no other axioms other than faith in God!

Ladies and gentlemen, you heard it here: Euclid professed his belief in God at least five times.

  1. "To draw a straight line from any point to any point."
  2. "To produce [extend] a finite straight line continuously in a straight line."
  3. "To describe a circle with any centre and distance [radius]."
  4. "That all right angles are equal to one another."
  5. The parallel postulate: "That, if a straight line falling on two straight lines make the interior angles on the same side less than two right angles, the two straight lines, if produced indefinitely, meet on that side on which are the angles less than the two right angles."


I mean come on, don't they teach affirming the consequent in philosophy?
2018-02-20, 12:31 AM #7459
Watch me prove that Jordan Peterson's argument is a non sequitur using exactly zero axioms:
2018-02-20, 12:31 AM #7460
fuuuuuuuuck this guy is a moron
2018-02-20, 12:37 AM #7461
Maybe he had these axioms in mind?

Quote:
E1: DEF. 1. By that which is self-caused, I mean that of which the essence involves existence, or that of which the nature is only conceivable as existent.

E1: DEF. 2. A thing is called finite after its kind, when it can be limited by another thing of the same nature; for instance, a body is called finite because we always conceive another greater body. So, also, a thought is limited by another thought, but a body is not limited by thought, nor a thought by body.

E1: DEF. 3. By substance, I mean that which is in itself, and is conceived through itself: in other words, that of which a conception can be formed independently of any other conception.

E1: DEF. 4. By attribute, I mean that which the intellect perceives as constituting the essence of substance.

E1: DEF. 5. By mode, I mean the modifications ["Affectiones"] of substance, or that which exists in, and is conceived through, something other than itself.

E1: DEF. 6. By God, I mean a being absolutely infinite--that is, a substance consisting in infinite attributes, of which each expresses eternal and infinite essentiality.
Explanation.--I say absolutely infinite, not infinite after its kind: for, of a thing infinite only after its kind, infinite attributes may be denied; but that which is absolutely infinite, contains in its essence whatever expresses reality, and involves no negation.

E1: DEF. 7. That thing is called free, which exists solely by the necessity of its own nature, and of which the action is determined by itself alone. On the other hand, that thing is necessary, or rather constrained, which is determined by something external to itself to a fixed and definite method of existence or action.

E1: DEF. 8. By eternity, I mean existence itself, in so far as it is conceived necessarily to follow solely from the definition of that which is eternal.
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 12:41 AM #7462
The explanation that he was just a mediocre professor at a backwater university who became famous for no good reason at all is making more sense to me every day.

I've encountered more than a couple college professors whose general opinion I'd never trust on finer intellectual questions, and I don't see why this guy is any different. Actually I don't know if I've ever had a professor as bad as Peterson, even at community college.
2018-02-20, 12:43 AM #7463
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
The explanation that he was just a mediocre professor at a backwater university who became famous for no good reason at all is making more sense to me every day.


Toronto isn't backwater!
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 12:43 AM #7464
Lol, my bad
2018-02-20, 12:44 AM #7465
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 12:46 AM #7466
Hahaha that Gungan looks fake as hell. I wonder why they didn't just find a real one
2018-02-20, 12:48 AM #7467
Originally posted by Eversor:
Maybe he had these axioms in mind?


No, I think he was thinking of the following argument:

(a+bn)/n=x, hence God exists
2018-02-20, 12:56 AM #7468
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
The explanation that he was just a mediocre professor at a backwater university who became famous for no good reason at all is making more sense to me every day.

I've encountered more than a couple college professors whose general opinion I'd never trust on finer intellectual questions, and I don't see why this guy is any different. Actually I don't know if I've ever had a professor as bad as Peterson, even at community college.


I’ll never understand why Americans allow themselves to know so little about the rest of the world. I’m not surprised by it anymore, I just don’t understand why.

University of Toronto is an excellent university, one of the best in the world, in one of the largest and most developed cities in the world. Jordan Peterson doesn’t belong there.
2018-02-20, 12:59 AM #7469
I actually didn't even know what university he went to. I am well aware of University of Toronto.

I am pretty sure I misremembered something that you wrote about his background. Actually I think it was something about growing up in (edit: rural) Alberta.
2018-02-20, 1:02 AM #7470
What I meant to say was (as I understand it) that Jordan Peterson wasn't a famous professor (despite the prestige of his institution) before becoming famous for the wrong reasons. And I think with that sentiment I am more correctly echoing what was already expressed earlier in this thread (and in other threads).
2018-02-20, 1:06 AM #7471
Originally posted by Jon`C:
Jordan Peterson doesn’t belong there.


And while I'll readily admit to being sloppy, I imagine a part of me just presumed that he would only be found at a backwater university.

Edit: Hah! I wonder what logical fallacy I myself had been engaging in by making that mistake.
2018-02-20, 1:14 AM #7472
You're banished from Otoh Gunga!
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 1:14 AM #7473
Talk about backwater...
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 1:17 AM #7474
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I actually didn't even know what university he went to. I am well aware of University of Toronto.

I am pretty sure I misremembered something that you wrote about his background. Actually I think it was something about growing up in (edit: rural) Alberta.


He grew up in rural northwest Alberta, in a village of 3000 people. He got his undergraduate degrees from my alma mater, and his graduate degree from McGill, the latter of which, at least, is another good institution. He teaches at UofT.

And I gotta tell ya, growing up in remote small town Alberta in the sixties, studying political science and psychology during the eugenics program, at the university that ran it... I dunno, man. Alberta’s had some bad times and bad folks, and Peterson is probably one of them. This province has changed a lot since he lived here, all for the better. Mostly because people of his cohort and prior have left, died, or have been diluted down to powerlessness. Old school Alberta would make Trump blush if he were still physiologically capable of it.
2018-02-20, 1:52 AM #7475
Why'd you study at University of Alberta, Jon?
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 3:06 AM #7476
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
Let's agree that religion is based on unproven assumptions by definition, and therefore independent of all scientific inquiry. This means that belief in God is simply an axiom, and one can choose to either accept, or reject it.


This would be a charitable reading of what Peterson wrote, and, in fact, I don't think it really squares with his tweet at all. But he could be thinking of faith as some kind of intuitive (rather than discursive) form of super-rational knowing, which offers greater certainty and is more true than reason.
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 3:10 AM #7477
Nobody knows what his tweet really means because it is an axiom, and requires faith. This is because its author was divinely inspired, and so by the transitive property of divinity, the tweet is true a priori.
2018-02-20, 3:11 AM #7478
OTOH, if you don't understand it, you are actually super ****ed up inside, and require therapy in order to exercise your inner demons, preferably by donating to Dr. Peterson's Patreon.
2018-02-20, 3:17 AM #7479
Also, if we take for granted that no proof is possible without axioms, why is God the only axiom?
former entrepreneur
2018-02-20, 3:19 AM #7480
it's funny that that tweet is almost five years old
former entrepreneur
123456789101112131415161718192021222324252627282930313233343536373839404142434445464748495051525354555657585960616263646566676869707172737475767778798081828384858687888990919293949596979899100101102103104105106107108109110111112113114115116117118119120121122123124125126127128129130131132133134135136137138139140141142143144145146147148149150151152153154155156157158159160161162163164165166167168169170171172173174175176177178179180181182183184185186187188189190191192193194195196197198199200201202203204205206207208209210211212213214215216217218219220221222223224225226227228229230231232233234235236237238239240241242243244245246247248249250251252253254255256257258259260261262263264265266267268269270271272273274275276277278279280281282283284285286287288289290291292293294295296297298299300301302303304305306307308309310311312313314315316317318319320321322323324325326327328329330331332333334335336337338339340341342343344345346347348349350351352353354355356357358359360361362363364365366367368369370371372373374375376377378379380381382383384385386387388389390391392393394395396397398399400401

↑ Up to the top!