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☖ Forums → Discussion Forum → Inauguration Day, Inauguration Hooooooraaay!
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Inauguration Day, Inauguration Hooooooraaay!
2018-10-22, 2:28 PM #12281
Hey, what if we all smash up some cheetos and wear them on our faces? Anyway, good points. Still interested in which show.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2018-10-22, 3:05 PM #12282
Rupert Murdoch is close friends with the Sauds. Awlaweed was the largest outside investor and an activist shareholder in Newscorp for more than 20 years, until he was purged last year. They have a super heavy editorial slant for KSA against their geopolitical rivals.

That’s why, for example, Republicans care a lot more about Iran than others do: because KSA hates Iran and makes Fox News et al spend time talking about how evil they are.

And they are, but let’s be frank here. Iran didn’t fly airplanes into the WTC. Saudi Arabia did.
2018-10-22, 3:09 PM #12283
I strongly encourage you to look into the historical relationship between the US and Saudi Arabia. It will make your blood boil. First your tax money was sent to the House of Saud to protect the oil companies, then your sovereignty was given away to protect the value of the dollar. The relationship between the USG and the KSA is an utter betrayal of the American people.
2018-10-22, 3:32 PM #12284
I wasn't being argumentative, I just wanted to see what you would say. I don't do cable news anymore, I find it all repugnant most of the time. We probably don't have much to disagree with on the Saudi topic.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2018-10-22, 3:46 PM #12285
Honestly I think half of the hoopla is people have built up a sense of antagonism to the Sauds, and this is a fine vector to let go of the decades of anger towards them and how they act on the world stage.
2018-10-22, 3:52 PM #12286
Why would they have antagonism built up against something they aren't even aware of? Since when are people who are easily swayed by the news media angry at KSA? It's been a long time since Michael Moore implied that they helped Bush do 911
2018-10-22, 4:18 PM #12287
Or maybe you mean journalists writing editorials and posting blogs, like the guys at Vox.
2018-10-22, 4:40 PM #12288
Originally posted by Jon`C:
Rupert Murdoch is close friends with the Sauds. Awlaweed was the largest outside investor and an activist shareholder in Newscorp for more than 20 years, until he was purged last year. They have a super heavy editorial slant for KSA against their geopolitical rivals.

That’s why, for example, Republicans care a lot more about Iran than others do: because KSA hates Iran and makes Fox News et al spend time talking about how evil they are.

And they are, but let’s be frank here. Iran didn’t fly airplanes into the WTC. Saudi Arabia did.


Not to deny the gist of what you’ve said here, but the US has had a complicated enough relationship with Iran that you don’t need recourse to Saudi money to explain why some Americans feel so much antagonism towards it. (Iran didn’t do 9/11, but it did bomb the US embassy in Lebanon.) The idea that the US is primarily antagonistic towards Iran because the Saudis want us to be (see the Yglesias article I referred to earlier, where he makes some tail wagging the dog arguments) seems like some more nonsense invented sometime in the past few weeks by people who are totally absorbed in the news cycle and lack any sort of perspective.

Obviously sympathy towards Iran’s other great regional adversary, Israel, is another reason why Republicans are more likely to be hostile towards Iran.
former entrepreneur
2018-10-22, 4:55 PM #12289
Suicide bombings were considered exclusively a shi’a phenomenon for a most of the 80s and much of the 90s, and were generally associated with Iranian terrorism. I believe that al-Zawahiri (bin Laden’s second in command, for those who don’t know) was partially responsible for making it a Sunni tactic, by organizing the first Sunni terrorist attacks that used it, iirc. More recent terrorism has made Iran’s use of terrorist tactics seem relatively insignificant in comparison.
former entrepreneur
2018-10-22, 5:00 PM #12290
Eversor, please read more carefully. I didn’t say it was the only reason they care, I said it was why they care more than others do (and why they think it’s a more urgent problem).

Nobody doubts that Iran is a baddie.
2018-10-22, 5:04 PM #12291
Originally posted by Jon`C:
Eversor, please read more carefully. I didn’t say it was the only reason they care, I said it was why they care more than others do (and why they think it’s a more urgent problem).

Nobody doubts that Iran is a baddie.


...and I didn’t say you said it’s the only reason they care..?
former entrepreneur
2018-10-23, 11:07 PM #12292
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1054834884739502081

Trump on Khashoggi's killing: "They had a very bad original concept. It was carried out poorly and the cover-up was one of the worst cover-ups in the history of cover-ups. It's very simple. Bad deal. Should have never been thought of. Somebody really messed up." (via ABC)
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2018-10-23, 11:18 PM #12293
Sounds like a mobster
2018-10-24, 9:28 AM #12294
Originally posted by Eversor:
Not to deny the gist of what you’ve said here, but the US has had a complicated enough relationship with Iran that you don’t need recourse to Saudi money to explain why some Americans feel so much antagonism towards it. (Iran didn’t do 9/11, but it did bomb the US embassy in Lebanon.) The idea that the US is primarily antagonistic towards Iran because the Saudis want us to be (see the Yglesias article I referred to earlier, where he makes some tail wagging the dog arguments) seems like some more nonsense invented sometime in the past few weeks by people who are totally absorbed in the news cycle and lack any sort of perspective.

Obviously sympathy towards Iran’s other great regional adversary, Israel, is another reason why Republicans are more likely to be hostile towards Iran.


Our relationship with Israel has a much larger effect on our relationship with SA. It might be the most important aspect.
2018-10-24, 9:32 AM #12295
Originally posted by Obi_Kwiet:
Our relationship with Israel has a much larger effect on our relationship with SA. It might be the most important aspect.


Not sure I agree, but what do you mean?
former entrepreneur
2018-10-24, 9:37 AM #12296
I sure hope some day we’ll learn all the hows and whys of the US-Israel relationship, the way we’ve recently learned them about Saudi Arabia. Usually the US doesn’t respond to an unprovoked attack on one of their warships with a deep alliance and billions a year in military aid.
2018-10-24, 9:38 AM #12297
(it’s probably because Israel has nuclear weapons and threatened to use them)
2018-10-24, 9:55 AM #12298
Originally posted by Jon`C:
(it’s probably because Israel has nuclear weapons and threatened to use them)

I'm sure Eversor will find a reason this was necessary
2018-10-24, 10:44 AM #12299
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/24/nyregion/clinton-obama-explosive-device.html

Quote:
Pipe bombs were sent to former President Barack Obama and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, as well as to CNN’s offices in New York, sparking an intense investigation on Wednesday into whether a bomber is going after targets that have often been the subject of right-wing ire.

A law enforcement official said the three devices were similar to one found Monday at the home of George Soros, the billionaire philanthropist and liberal donor.


I guess they're just being careful, but seems pretty obvious that this is politically motivated.
2018-10-24, 10:49 AM #12300
You can't prove that.

And if you can, it's okay because the left is more violent.
2018-10-24, 11:30 AM #12301
All the finger-pointing (if the perpetrator is on the other side) and all the minimizing that happens (if the perpetrator is on your side) when someone commits some act of violence or is physically threatening is becoming a predictable response to these sorts of events. The left and right both do it.

Maybe we'd be better off if instead of doing it, we found common cause with people on the other side who agree with us that violence is bad no matter who does it, and established as a shared norm among us that politically motivated violence is bad, and can be tolerated under no conditions (and, in fact, that it's irrelevant who does it)?
former entrepreneur
2018-10-24, 11:43 AM #12302
Originally posted by Eversor:
shared norm among us that politically motivated violence is bad


ha
2018-10-24, 11:48 AM #12303
[https://i.imgur.com/yLHXGyi.png]
2018-10-24, 1:35 PM #12304
Originally posted by Eversor:
Maybe we'd be better off if instead of doing it, we found common cause with people on the other side who agree with us that violence is bad no matter who does it, and established as a shared norm among us that politically motivated violence is bad, and can be tolerated under no conditions (and, in fact, that it's irrelevant who does it)?


I want to believe this, but what about the fact that mainstream consevatives tolerate and even spread (in the case of Sean Hannity) dangerous conspiracy theories (pizzagate, Sandy Hook, etc.) that motivate people to actual violence?
2018-10-24, 1:36 PM #12305
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I want to believe this, but what about the fact that mainstream consevatives tolerate and even spread (in the case of Sean Hannity) dangerous conspiracy theories (pizzagate, Sandy Hook, etc.) that motivate people to actual violence?


don't be ridiculous, radical conservative television hosts only call terrorists to action in muslim countries
2018-10-24, 1:38 PM #12306
I don't know what conservativism which categorically rejects the likes of Hannity, et al looks like, but you can better be sure it won't win any elections in most gerrymandered districts.
2018-10-24, 2:24 PM #12307
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I want to believe this, but what about the fact that mainstream consevatives tolerate and even spread (in the case of Sean Hannity) dangerous conspiracy theories (pizzagate, Sandy Hook, etc.) that motivate people to actual violence?


Hannity has taken some hits in the past for promoting conspiracy theories. He lost many of his advertisers for promoting the Seth Rich conspiracy theory, for instance. It was looking pretty shaky there for a second, and some even wondered if he was going to get the boot from Fox.

Needless to say, though, Hannity isn't someone with whom to find common cause.
former entrepreneur
2018-10-24, 2:53 PM #12308
https://old.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/9r2fha/full_panic_mode_with_less_than_2_weeks_to_cram/

Meanwhile, Trump supporters are really mad at Democrats for faking the bombs.

Edit: imagine being so dumb you think Starship Troopers is not a satire: https://old.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/9r2peo/the_safety_of_the_american_people_is_my_highest/e8dp2wi/
2018-10-24, 3:06 PM #12309
huh, i've heard about the_donald a lot, but man, that really is like, it's really a full on little cult thing isn't it? weird.
2018-10-24, 3:13 PM #12310
why yves I am trump-voting patriot, comrade
2018-10-24, 5:09 PM #12311
Originally posted by saberopus:
huh, i've heard about the_donald a lot, but man, that really is like, it's really a full on little cult thing isn't it? weird.


Yeah. There are at least a couple voices of moderation, but the overwhelming chorus is "crazy dems upset about the midterm". It's wild.

Like it'd be one thing if they were just downplaying dems being targeted.. but the way they just immediately claim it's a false flag is disturbing.
2018-10-24, 6:35 PM #12312
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I want to believe this, but what about the fact that mainstream consevatives tolerate and even spread (in the case of Sean Hannity) dangerous conspiracy theories (pizzagate, Sandy Hook, etc.) that motivate people to actual violence?


I pretty much washed my hands of Sean Hannity during the election but I'm pretty sure you have him confused with Alex Jones. It's also pretty amusing to watch leftists pretend political violence in America isn't mostly perpetrated by leftists but it's also pretty sad to see people fall for it.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2018-10-24, 6:38 PM #12313
Originally posted by Wookie06:
I pretty much washed my hands of Sean Hannity during the election but I'm pretty sure you have him confused with Alex Jones. It's also pretty amusing to watch leftists pretend political violence in America isn't mostly perpetrated by leftists but it's also pretty sad to see people fall for it.


I knew you'd say something like this
2018-10-24, 6:57 PM #12314
Why wouldn't I? The only thing the left hasn't managed to revive from the 60s yet are the assassinations. Yet.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2018-10-24, 7:07 PM #12315
Originally posted by Wookie06:
I pretty much washed my hands of Sean Hannity during the election but I'm pretty sure you have him confused with Alex Jones.


You're half right here actually. I was indeed confusing Sean Hannity with Sarn Cadrill Alex Jones when I mentioned Pizzagate and Sandy Hook. However, Hannity most certainly was peddling the conspiracy theory that the Clintons assassinated Seth Rich, which is probably what I was thinking of.

This of course is far less surprising: right wing conspiracy theories about the Clintons are almost as old as sliced bread.
2018-10-24, 7:17 PM #12316
Originally posted by Reid:
Edit: imagine being so dumb you think Starship Troopers is not a satire: https://old.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/9r2peo/the_safety_of_the_american_people_is_my_highest/e8dp2wi/


if you're too connected to the internet, you'll know who sargon of akkad is. if you're not, he's a lame youtuber who makes videos about political stuff.. claims to be "fair" but sides with the alt right on most issues.

i guess he's unironically defending the humans in starship troopers now and dumped comments all over starship trooper videos defending that the fascists were right

only in 2018 do you have internet fascists defending fascists in fascist satire against the satire of the film itself. the world we live in is incredible.. so complex and full of surprises.
2018-10-24, 7:19 PM #12317
Originally posted by Wookie06:
It's also pretty amusing to watch leftists pretend political violence in America isn't mostly perpetrated by leftists but it's also pretty sad to see people fall for it.


yah, people like the Department of Homeland Security.

Left wing terrorism was eclipsed by right wing terrorism in the 1980s, but to be fair to you, that is when you made up your mind.
2018-10-24, 7:23 PM #12318
Let's not forget that I'm in at least one of the likely categories of domestic terrorists so take it for what it's worth.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2018-10-24, 7:23 PM #12319
Originally posted by Jon`C:
yah, people like the Department of Homeland Security.

Left wing terrorism was eclipsed by right wing terrorism in the 1980s, but to be fair to you, that is when you made up your mind.


throwing popcorn at a rhino
2018-10-24, 7:47 PM #12320
Youtube comments are hilarious/depressing:

Quote:
Now I can't watch Starship Troopers without thinking the bugs are SJWs controlled by giant feminist bugs.


Quote:
OMG I just realised that Antifa are basically youth gangs from A Clockwork Orange...


Quote:
I"m glad someone finally nailed it: Starship Troopers was a ****ty movie made to smear a great book, and it failed as the communist propaganda piece they tried to turn it into


And the funniest comment ever:

Quote:
[Starship Troopers] (and "Doom: Knee Deep in the Dead" by Dafydd ab Hugh) really informed how I viewed things morally, and influenced me heavily in my path after high school. As I grow older, it continues to influence me. You hit it out of the park with this. Awesome job.


So many people claiming Starship Troopers was influential on how they view politics.. all I can say is yikes. How many people read only fiction to try and understand the world?
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