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ForumsDiscussion Forum → Inauguration Day, Inauguration Hooooooraaay!
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Inauguration Day, Inauguration Hooooooraaay!
2017-02-15, 3:39 PM #761
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I was talking about the Sudetenland.


I know. :)
former entrepreneur
2017-02-15, 3:39 PM #762
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
Yes, along with their propaganda masters on talk radio, and that little ***** Paul Ryan.

UNLESS, we just all get lucky and nothing terrible enough happens before the next election that we can't fix it later. But holy cow, it's been what, like almost a month?


Regardless of whatever crisis we're in now, we have to consider the political situation that got us here. It's not enough to put the blame on Russians, because that fails to address the systemic issues that allowed Russian propaganda to be successful.

Trump would have never gotten two steps forward in politics if not for the rest of Republicans to have trainwrecked so hard that an idiot could trounce them. But wasn't a trainwreck from the Republicans inevitable? You can't have a party who's core political constituency is paranoid, highly religious, uneducated idiots without coming to a crisis.

I feel this isn't just a random occurrence, it's the results of decades of political momentum and failings within American institutions themselves. But this is a hard question that nobody wants to confront, so instead we have alot of banality regarding Trump's presidency.
2017-02-15, 3:40 PM #763
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
I am sure you are right, but it sure didn't hurt that we had our doors open to some pretty snazzy refugees.


Like machinists, who were promised patents on any inventions they stole from Europe.
2017-02-15, 3:45 PM #764
Quote:
Regardless of whatever crisis we're in now


This is sort of where you lose me. Let's all just remind ourselves that most of the damage that Trump does to the world happens in the future.

Sure, by all means lets address our economic and political problems, but also let's not forget we are in a crisis whose trajectory seems pretty murky to me, with some very bad outcomes on the table. Forgive me if I can't be bothered to criticize the shortcomings of institutions that might help us take this problem child off our hands.
2017-02-15, 3:52 PM #765
Originally posted by Jon`C:
Like machinists, who were promised patents on any inventions they stole from Europe.


Heh.

There was a little publishing house you may have heard of, called Dover Books, whose first book was Tables of Functions with Formulas and Curves, whose German copyright was voided by the USG.

But still, the people who wrote books like that also jumping ship was sort of a big deal. For the most part, we still have their academic descendants.
2017-02-15, 3:55 PM #766
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
This is sort of where you lose me. Let's all just remind ourselves that most of the damage that Trump does to the world happens in the future.

Sure, by all means lets address our economic problem and political problems, but also let's not forget we are in a crisis whose trajectory seems pretty murky to me, with some very bad outcomes on the table. Forgive me if I can't be bothered to criticize the shortcomings of institutions that might help us take this problem child off our hands.


Let's say the best happens-Trump is impeached and convicted tomorrow, and replaced as president. He is replaced by a competent enough leader and Russia loses any semblance of control in the executive branch.

Even assuming this could happen, I don't think it would do much to stop something similar from happening again in another election, because it doesn't do anything to resolve the domestic problems that made Trump popular. Populist rhetoric will still be effective, grievances will still continue. Which means for how much hate you carry for Trump, he's just a drop in the bucket if the larger cultural trends that caused Trump don't go away. It's not at all obvious to me that in 2020 everyone's going to magically shift back and vote Democrat. In fact, with the damage Trump has done, and probably will continue to do, it might shock Americans into shifting even further right, into accepting even more fascist rhetoric. "The next one won't be like Trump". Maybe he will be.

Of course things could end up much worse with a Trump presidency, the problem is just that you're putting too much emphasis on just Trump.
2017-02-15, 3:57 PM #767
Originally posted by Reverend Jones:
For the most part, we still have their academic descendants.


Unfortunately, it does look like the current government might not actually want to employ them, or create economic incentives in the economy to justify their work....
2017-02-15, 3:59 PM #768
Also don't forget, as self-driving vehicles become more common, we could see millions lose work in America. This could have an effect even in 2020, if not definitely by 2024. I'd assume without evidence that truck drivers are majority right-wing, Trump supporters. Without work, that's a huge source of resentful, proto-fascist racism that's going to have nowhere to go but right into the American political scene.
2017-02-15, 4:00 PM #769
Originally posted by Reid:
Of course things could end up much worse with a Trump presidency, the problem is just that you're putting too much emphasis on just Trump.


When I say "Trump", you can assume it's a synecdoche for his administration, even if I didn't mean it that way, and it will probably be true.
2017-02-15, 4:01 PM #770
Leave it to a Marxist to focus on the grand sweep of history in the middle of a crisis (for better or for worse).
2017-02-15, 4:02 PM #771
I'd like to introduce you to my good friend, Jerry Mander.
2017-02-15, 4:13 PM #772
LMAO, I am at a loss at which one of three or more interpretations of that I ought to take. :P

  1. Gerrymandering will ensure Republican control over the next 8 years
  2. Jerry Mander's book about the medium of television destroying the quality of public discourse speaks to my short attention span in addressing Reid's deeper discussion
  3. Professors employed in the United States can do like Jerry Mander's parents did in the U.S.: abandon a successful life in the old country, and find jobs in China in the garment industry once it becomes established that the country has no need for intellectuals
2017-02-15, 4:25 PM #773
Looks like Russia is not too happy about American troops and equipment (4,000 troops and also 2,400 pieces of military equipment, including tanks and Humvees) being deployed in Poland.

Apparently, according to Russian propaganda, it's all "a mean trick on President-elect Donald Trump who won the election" by outgoing President Obama. Oh, and NATO is just like expansionist Nazi Germany.

But, you know, all things considered, I can kind of sympathize with Poland being uneasy about having nefarious neighbours, ya know?
2017-02-15, 6:46 PM #774
This whole Flynn thing?

Turns out, it's Obama fault!
2017-02-15, 10:25 PM #775
I don't know if this has been posted here yet, but has anyone looked at The Foundations of Geopolitics: The Geopolitical Future of Russia?
Epstein didn't kill himself.
2017-02-15, 10:56 PM #776
Well with their decision to throw in with the Trump campaign, all I can say is that I guess the folks in the Kremlin really did their homework back in university:

Quote:
In the United States:

Russia should use its special forces within the borders of the United States to fuel instability and separatism, for instance, provoke "Afro-American racists". Russia should "introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity, encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the U.S. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics."[1]
2017-02-15, 10:58 PM #777
Spetsnaz being responsible for BLM is the most thriller movie thing I can possibly imagine. 2017 may prove to be Tom Clancy's most implausible novel.
Epstein didn't kill himself.
2017-02-16, 1:53 AM #778
Quote:
There is more consequential IC pushback happening, too. Our spies have never liked Trump’s lackadaisical attitude toward the President’s Daily Brief, the most sensitive of all IC documents, which the new commander-in-chief has received haphazardly. The president has frequently blown off the PDB altogether, tasking Flynn with condensing it into a one-page summary with no more than nine bullet-points. Some in the IC are relieved by this, but there are pervasive concerns that the president simply isn’t paying attention to intelligence.


In light of this, and out of worries about the White House’s ability to keep secrets, some of our spy agencies have begun withholding intelligence from the Oval Office. Why risk your most sensitive information if the president may ignore it anyway? A senior National Security Agency official explained that NSA was systematically holding back some of the “good stuff” from the White House, in an unprecedented move. For decades, NSA has prepared special reports for the president’s eyes only, containing enormously sensitive intelligence. In the last three weeks, however, NSA has ceased doing this, fearing Trump and his staff cannot keep their best SIGINT secrets.


Since NSA provides something like 80 percent of the actionable intelligence in our government, what’s being kept from the White House may be very significant indeed. However, such concerns are widely shared across the IC, and NSA doesn’t appear to be the only agency withholding intelligence from the administration out of security fears.


What’s going on was explained lucidly by a senior Pentagon intelligence official, who stated that “since January 20, we’ve assumed that the Kremlin has ears inside the SITROOM,” meaning the White House Situation Room, the 5,500 square-foot conference room in the West Wing where the president and his top staffers get intelligence briefings. “There’s not much the Russians don’t know at this point,” the official added in wry frustration.


Source: http://observer.com/2017/02/donald-trump-administration-mike-flynn-russian-embassy/
2017-02-16, 5:44 PM #779
Originally posted by Spook:
Spetsnaz being responsible for BLM is the most thriller movie thing I can possibly imagine. 2017 may prove to be Tom Clancy's most implausible novel.


I wonder who will write it.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2017-02-16, 9:12 PM #780
J.K. Rowling under the pseudonym D.J. Trump
Epstein didn't kill himself.
2017-02-17, 11:49 AM #781
DJ Trump.

something something drop the base.
2017-02-17, 9:21 PM #782
Good speech in Munch by Mccain. Pretty funny how he implied what an atrocious steward of Western civilization President Trump is being, by reciting people in the government who he actually trusts to do a good job, including Vice President Pence!

Also, I wonder what this could be?
2017-02-19, 8:09 AM #783
.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/832708293516632065
ORJ / My Level: ORJ Temple Tournament I
2017-02-19, 2:30 PM #784
At least somebody's saying it.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2017-02-19, 3:56 PM #785
"Lugenpresse"
2017-02-19, 4:51 PM #786
A pillar of society is looking dangerously cracked. To be sure, its symmetric perfection had been frustrated from nearly the beginning by all too familiar blemishes, eventually developing outright cracks here and there... but never quite so severely as it had by now. In fact, onlookers now found themselves at something of a loss as to whether or not this object could really have been a pillar of anything at all--surely, something now so badly degraded could never actually have been an essential part of the foundation for anything so mighty as the edifice which seems now to stand alone beside it, in defiant autonomy.

Overnight, sentiment that the pillar must go was crystallized into an unspoken Zeitgeist, rescuing as well sundry other misgivings that had before been all but damned to vainly ferment in apparent perpetuity.

Nevertheless, a cadre of rather suspicious looking pillar apologists would also emerge from the confusion, and before long, their intransigence would become all too evident. In earnest unison, they would clamour together, claiming not only that they alone possessed the unique ability to fill the cracks of the now precarious pillar, but moreover, that the necessity of the pillar itself was in fact indisputable, by their own logic, and therefore their own authority.

It would be at this precise moment in which a daring champion could reify the unspoken Zeitgeist, explicating it directly to the people, altogether shedding the timidity characteristic of leaders in older times. Now, our champion had only to speak forbidden truth of society's unsoundness categorically, plainly, and undeniably. This would serve to once and for all drive off the snakes, who would unpatriotically stand in the way of its fundamental restructuring (and who would instead have us focus instead on their precious but ultimately false pillar, all the while the rest of it crumbles completely).

In fact, our champion would be so effective, that what had previously been subdued into tame resentment, is suddenly whipped into a frenzy, fomenting society into a great transformation.

Now, suppose we are to take this man's words as truly speaking to some unacknowledged Zeitgeist, which would propel us into a new golden age, for want only of being spoken by somebody so brave or independently-minded as him. My question is this: given the unprecedented ease with which he sheds customs of propriety, logic, and fact for purely opportunistic rhetorical whims, exactly why shouldn't we also consider the possibility that the transformation he will bring will also be tainted by the same level of opportunism? Or that the very narrative in this post is also the result of opportunism? And have we been here before?
2017-02-19, 4:51 PM #787
Damn, Jon beat me to it.
2017-02-19, 4:54 PM #788
And, unsurprisingly, in a far superior manner.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2017-02-19, 4:57 PM #789
Superior because he straight up called you a Nazi sympathizer, rather than working super hard to dance around Godwin's law through some kind of half-ass fable?

Good to know you're okay with the simpler explanation, I guess.
2017-02-19, 4:59 PM #790
Unless you actually interpreted Jon's post as unironically as in favor of the neo-Nazi's who use that term... ahahahahahaha
2017-02-19, 5:38 PM #791
Yeah, I'm soo Nazi.
"I would rather claim to be an uneducated man than be mal-educated and claim to be otherwise." - Wookie 03:16

2017-02-19, 5:41 PM #792
Still on board the Lugenpresse Reichsbahn, though? Or did I misinterpret your use of the word superior?
2017-02-19, 7:34 PM #793
2017-02-19, 8:08 PM #794
It's interesting how treason doesn't make you an enemy of the American people, but reporting on it does.
2017-02-19, 8:33 PM #795
well if we extend libertarian homesteading theory to the category of factoids, it would behoove each party to beat the other to the punch in binding a meme onto the pattern of "enemy of the people". And why not, along the way, use it to target the one group that would have been likely to eventually do just that to you (albeit in the category of actual facts)?

Edit: completely mangled that last bit
2017-02-19, 8:38 PM #796
Total change of topic.

Do you know what struggle Hitler was talking about when he titled his book Mein Kampf? In fact, the book was named after his struggle against the media, and the insults and lies he felt were written about him. The book frames Hitler's opinions with his conflicts with the press, and always returned to that issue; essentially, the book was a meandering diatribe against the media, and why Hitler felt they were a threat against the German people. Hitler did voice many criticisms of the press which were likely legitimate at the time, and are even true today - such as powerful interests wielding the press for political gain, and industry solidarity against their own criticism. However accurate his observations, though, it was always clear that Hitler never seriously considered the press a threat to the German people, but only to himself. He was simply too megalomaniacal to distinguish between his interests and those of Germany, even at that early point.

History might have turned out very differently, if only a few more Germans thought that a low-quality free press was better than not having one at all.
2017-02-19, 8:47 PM #797
Ah! But thankfully, since Americans were all told to read Mein Kampf in school rather than hear it from a Canadian on an obscure online message board...
2017-02-19, 8:50 PM #798
Right?
2017-02-19, 8:53 PM #799
In other news: Some toxic, embarrassing 4chan celebrity was tapped to deliver keynote for CPAC; turns out to be a statutory rape advocate.
2017-02-19, 8:54 PM #800
actually I never read it :-/

I'll put it on request from the public library, but it so happens that the book is popular enough right now that there is a hold line
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